Dan:
RICK:
I believe (like Struan) that Pirsig asked one very
> > important question (What evidence do we have that Quality=Reality?) and
> > answered another rather innocuous question (What evidence do we have
that
> > value is real?).
>
DAN:
> Now it seems to me both questions are basically asking the same thing. If
we say something is "real" then it is really part of reality.
RICK:
I don't think they are... Asking whether something is a part of reality is a
far cry from asking whether that something IS reality. If the two questions
above are asking then samething then anything that can be proved to be real
IS reality itself.
DAN:
A person dying of thirst in the desert or freezing to death in the cold
may experience vivid hallucinations and end up committing some very
bizarre acts that hold no value in our agreed upon reality. And value is
considered synonymous with Quality in the MOQ. Pirsig calls it the
Metaphysics of Value early on in Lila. So how do we know value (Quality)
is (equals) real (reality)? "By the harmony it produces."
The dude swallowing sand in the desert may believe it is the nectar of the
Gods
he is drinking down but unless he receives some help very soon his
harmonious life will end. There is no harmony in such acts.
RICK:
Very tricky indeed Dan.... "value(Quality) is (equals) real (reality)".....
You have equivocated between "real" and "reality". Let me explain... When I
ask if Santa Claus is real I am not asking if Santa Claus = Reality.
Rather, I am asking whether Santa Claus is actually a part of reality. Your
example (like Pirsig's recent excursion into economics) proves only that
value (quality) is real (an actual part of reality). Of course, the man
drinking sand in the desert (or anyone for that matter) could not be in a
low quality situation if quality weren't real. That is, if quality weren't
an actual part of reality.
Having fun,
Rick
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