Hi Glenn:
You flunked the Pirsigian Test (4 Yes’s out of 20) , but why am I not
surprised? (-:
GLENN:
Neither Pirsig nor anyone on this forum has convinced me that
substance is morality. Of course I know part of my problem is getting
over the conventional definition of morality. Even so, I don't see any
great advantage to thinking this way, even on aesthetic grounds.
No one in the science world has convinced me that life accidentally
popped up from no life or that mind randomly arose from no mind. The
great advantage in thinking the MOQ way is that it adheres to the
scientific Principle of Causality, presenting a rationale for evolution with
far greater explanatory power than the non-causality, scientific
hypothesis of “Oops.”
GLENN:
Why are you limiting this and the previous question to earth? Pirsig
doesn’t.
Granted. Earth, world, universe – all synonyms in some contexts. A
deeper problem is that many scientists like Carl Sagan limit the
meaning of “universe” (and indeed “reality’) to energy (and its alter ego,
matter), calling mind, if it is acknowledged at all, a mere
epiphenomenom. Of course, those who empirically come in contact
with anything remotely associated with “spirit” are hooted out of
science’s “universe.”
Lest you think I’m an hard-core basher of science and scientists, let
me clarify my position by quoting from H. Smith, author of “Forgotten
Truth:”
”With science I have no quarrel. Scientism is another matter. Whereas
science is positive, contenting itself with reporting what it discovers,
scientism is negative. It goes beyond the actual findings of science to
deny that other approaches to knowledge are valid or other truths true.
In a way, the success of science has gone to people’s heads like too
much rum, causing them to lose their grip on logic. They’ve come to
believe that what science discovers casts doubt on things it does not
discover, and that the success it realizes in its own domain throws into
question the reality of domains its methods and devices cannot touch.”
Since science cannot touch the domain of values, and yet, as you
admit, we posses a sense of quality that is a genuine perception, it
appears something besides mind is missing from science’s
“universe,” leaving Pirsig a wide open field to explore. That he treads
on some scientistic toes while doing so should not come as a
surprise.
Platt
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