Hi all,
Just a side note on the eskimo/snow debate. The plot in Peter Hoeg's novel,
"Miss Smilla's Feeling for Snow" depends upon her greater ability to
discriminate between different forms, and (without going back to check) I'm
pretty sure she gives different words. So even if it's not as great a
difference as forty words, that's a bit of anecdotal evidence to suggest
that their language is more nuanced than ours.
Sam
----- Original Message -----
From: "Patrick van den Berg" <cirandar@yahoo.com>
To: <moq_discuss@moq.org>
Sent: Friday, February 01, 2002 6:06 PM
Subject: Re: MD History
> Hi Erin and Rick,
>
> --- enoonan <enoonan@kent.edu> wrote:
> > RICK:In LILA Pirsig cites Whorf's Eskimo research for what appears to
> > be the
> > more 'extreme' version. The 'hoax' is that Whorf apparently made the
> > whole
> > research up. He never did any research and never even met an eskimo
> > (Diana
> > referenced some material on this... I'll see if I can dig up the posts
> > for
> > you).
>
> I would be interested in the reference too. I assume you're talking
> about the 'research' that indicated that Eskimo's have (about) 40 words
> for snow? I've heard that example in Germany and in Holland during
> psychology lectures. But then I heard someone say it was a lie or myth.
> I've told that to a German researcher, but he came up with the reference
> saying it IS true that Eskimo's have this many words for snow. I
> couldn't give him the reference that said it was a myth. It's a very
> stubborn myth.
>
>
> > Most of the research I know looked at specific words such as color
> > words.
>
> Yes, I once read about such a research in the newspaper, too. There was
> a comparison between European (English I believe) and some African
> cultures. In European languages, we make a distinction between (maybe
> the colors are wrong in my memory) green and yellow, and that
> distinction (in language, that is) wasn't made in the African culture.
> The latter culture, however, had two words for another color, maybe
> orange or something. The researchers had found a statistically
> significant result indicating that Europeans could easier differentiate
> between green en yellow, and the Africans between different hues of
> orange (or another color). So it does seem that language influences
> perception; but only in a very small amount.
>
> I don't know any Japanese, but I've heard that Japanese is a more
> pictorial, poetic or intuitive language than our Western languages (with
> German arguably as the most exact and differentiated). I don't think
> people growing up in Japan or in Germany differ much in their perception
> of reality. I do think, however, that the tiny differences in perception
> and thought DID have large consequences on the (philosophies) of the
> Japanese and Western CULTURES, through a couple of thousand years of
> history... (an example maybe of the butterfly-effect).
> Maybe the distinction between genes and environment makes sense. I state
> that our perception and way of thinking primarily is a (biological)
> evolutionary heritage, and that the influence of environment or culture
> is not so fundamental in our thinking and perception...
> Wittgenstein said that philosophy is about playing with language. Maybe
> philosophers who think alot in concepts that are already laid down in
> the language of their culture (note: I'm talking about words and
> concepts, not grammar!) DO arrive at a different view on reality, but
> it's 'just' conceptual: Our intuitive thinking and perception maybe
> don't differ alot between the cultures...
>
> That's my thoughts on the matter... Greetings, Patrick.
>
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