Hi Joćo, Squonk and all
Joćo wrote:
> Consider communication between humans and an internet-based artificial
> intelligence software.
..
Squonk answered:
>I have argued this myself, but no-one replied!
>Bo does not like it too much as it does not place the MOQ as 5th level.
>
>To adopt a slightly radical tone, i have been toying with the idea that SOM
>may be 5th level and your suggestion (6th level)? the first real move towards
>a non-human level in the MOQ since the inorganic.
I was thinking about this a few years ago but I'm afraid I missed your post recently. I also wrote an essay, more or less starting with this question.
My answer does not involve higher levels, but it does involve making the social level less human-centric. The social level becomes something like:
"Cooperating inorganic patterns."
In another thread, the social level is also being discussed and even Pirsig was quoted by Dan writing:
"Anders is slipping into the materialist assumption that there is a huge world out there that has nothing to do with people. The
MOQ says that is a high quality assumption, within limits. One of
its limits is that without humans to make it that assumption cannot be made. ..."
Doesn't that sound a lot like Descartes, "I think, therefore I am"?
It sounds like:
We can't say anything about what we can't experience first-hand, syo why bother?
Boring, if you ask me.
And a MoQ in those lines has no business calling itself a metaphysics. Perhaps a "metahuman science" but not metaphysics.
(It also sounds as if it somehow disqualifies physics alltogether. Physics mostly use instruments to make measurments, or to experience reality. Humans are only experienceing the events indirectly.)
I want future humans to be able to meet non-humans from other worlds and not make fools of themselves claiming that the others are not real or whatever such a metahuman science entails.
I'm sorry if I sound a bit harsh, but I'm interested in the MoQ because I think it has potential of becoming a really powerful metaphysics. But if it's restricted to humans, I'd say, "why bother?".
Magnus
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