Hi David and all the other God talkers,
I really like David's take:
DMB says:
> My take on "God" comes from lots of places, but in terms of the MOQ I
think
> that God is DQ and SQ is God's creation. Ultimately, they are both divine
> and are One. I quite agree that DQ is the source and the goal of creation.
> As far as our ideas of the creator, I like Joe Campbell's pithy
description.
> He said that "God is the ultimate archetype". Based on that and lots of
> other thoughts like it, I think our "ideas" about go way back into social
> level, at least.
Gary response: Wow, so much harmony and agreement I'm not sure what to do.
It's obviously all God's fault! ;) I like the SQ is "God's Creation".
Any chance you can find where Campbell said "God is the ultimate archetype"?
Nice phrase, I'm sure it would come in handy and would like to cite it
sometime and somewhere..
>DMB: Gary and all:
>
> You want to talk about God, eh? Well, nobody can accuse you of being
> trivial.
>
> Gary said:
> Here's my take on "God" under MOQ. Pure Quality is
> both the ground of being that created/gave the
> universe its structure, and it is the goal of being
> that we humans are reaching up to when we have any
> sort of mysticall experience. Our idea of "god" is a
> static pattern which is may start as a mystical
> experience.
>
> DMB says:
> My take on "God" comes from lots of places, but in terms of the MOQ I
think
> that God is DQ and SQ is God's creation. Ultimately, they are both divine
> and are One. I quite agree that DQ is the source and the goal of creation.
> As far as our ideas of the creator, I like Joe Cambell's pithy
description.
> He said that "God is the ultimate archetype". Based on that and lots of
> other thoughts like it, I think our "ideas" about go way back into social
> level, at least.
>
> Gary said:
> But, when we try to understand that experience of
> pure Quality we have to interpret it within our
> culture/s mythos and our own metaphoric ideas. All
> this is going on at the 4th level, the level of
> intellect.
>
> DMB says:
> Adding to what I said above, I think one of the most remarkable features
of
> the intellectual level is skepticism about God. Isn't that what got
Socrates
> in trouble? Didn't Galileo's trouble stem from his percieved contradiction
> of Biblical truth. Didn't the scientific revolution and the rise of
> rationality lead to the "death of God"? I think so. But yes, people in the
> present should and ought to interpret mystical experience through the 4th
> level and I feel quite certain that such an interpretation would both defy
> and explain the traditional, pre-modern concepts of God.
>
> Gary said:
> So, when we go to interpret our experience
> what we will understand will be affected by how
> evolved we are personally and how evolved our culture
> is.
>
> DMB says:
> Yes. It couldn't be any other way. And in spite of all the talk about pure
> DQ, the interpretation is crucial. It has to be given meaning or such
> experiences will not have a lasting effect. Even mystical experience needs
> static latching or it will, in some sense, be forgotten.
>
> Gary said:
> The experience of mystically reaching Quality is
> potentially there for anyone, but what a person brings
> back from that height is affected by what kind of
> personality they were before they had the mystic
> expericnece.
>
> DMB says:
> Right on. I know, or rather knew, people who interpreted their experiences
> within the context of fundamentalist religion and came to believe that
"The
> gifts of God" could not be found outside the church, as if the precher
done
> it for 'em. Hallelujah! Praise the Lord and pass the gravy! (Americanism)
>
> Gary said:
> An aside: When I first encountered Ken Wilber what
> excited me was that he asked: what is the best a human
> being theoritically could be?
>
> DMB says:
> Exactly. He and lots of other thinkers are eager to point out that a
person
> can have a spiritual life AND still have respect for intelligence,
science,
> evolution, and lots of other things that tend to be rejected by
traditional
> religion. To enter that church, one need not check their brains at the
door.
> Traditional religion may have opened the heart, but the next stage
involves
> the mind and beyond.
>
> Thanks,
> DMB
>
>
>
> MOQ.ORG - http://www.moq.org
> Mail Archive - http://alt.venus.co.uk/hypermail/moq_discuss/
> MD Queries - horse@darkstar.uk.net
>
> To unsubscribe from moq_discuss follow the instructions at:
> http://www.moq.org/md/subscribe.html
MOQ.ORG - http://www.moq.org
Mail Archive - http://alt.venus.co.uk/hypermail/moq_discuss/
MD Queries - horse@darkstar.uk.net
To unsubscribe from moq_discuss follow the instructions at:
http://www.moq.org/md/subscribe.html
This archive was generated by hypermail 2b30 : Sat Aug 17 2002 - 16:02:19 BST