RATIONAL ROGER ADDRESSES SOLIPSISM AND
PATTERNS AND DECOHERES INTO MYSTIC ROGER
Before I continue this inquiry into the good, I need to address two issues.
First, there was David's solipsism concern (a very valid point), and then the
issue of "what is sq formed of?"
On Solipsism:
I have tried to walk this line closely without crossing, though I think David
caught me with at least one toe over .Let me remove it forcefully......My
inspiration for defining DQ and the QE around experience while avoiding
solipsism is heavily influenced by Nishida, (Jeff may notice the similarity in
approach) as well as by two Gurus of the MOQ.....Ant and Bo.
For Bodvar's take on it, read the Quality Event in the forum.....A
MASTERPIECE!
For Ant's, read his forum post thesis paper..... The benefit of Ant's is that
he got Pirsig's input as he composed it....a rare treat indeed.!!!!
Starting with Ant, I quote:
"From a mystic point of view, I think you can say that experience (or what
Pirsig terms the QE) creates all entities from sub-atomic particles to people
so the question for whom or what HAS the experience does not arise (as
experience has them)."
Bo says the same thing in the QE paper......(Part 1 p6):
"Quality is.....the event that makes the subject aware of the object, which
means that quality isn't the result of the collision of the two, but the other
way around. The quality event is the cause of both subjects and objects!"
And here is what Nishida wrote 80 years ago.....
"At the time of pure experience, there is still no opposition between subject
and object and no separation of knowledge, feeling, and volition; there is
only an independent, self sufficient, pure activity."
And:
"One issue that we encounter is that of possible solipsism.....That
consciousness must be someone's conciousness simply means that consciousness
must have a unity.The idea that there must be a possessor of consciousness
above and beyond this unity is an arbitrary assumption."
Walter wrote:
"Roger uses Experience all the time and if it is meant as in 'going through' I
agree. For example:
In it's existence a pattern experiences (goes through) change and experiences
(goes through)
interactions with other patterns. Am I right here Rog?"
I think if I need to define experience I would equate it with "value
interaction" with the caveat that Bo clarifies above. Experience creates us
and the world.
Yesterday, David wrote:
"Each level has its own subjective kind of awareness, its own reality."
I think that David is correct. Ant also commented on something similar:
" In the MOQ, the higher up the evolutionary ladder you go (from subatomic
particles to people) the more freedom you have in making preferences. This is
why generally a person's experience will be much richer and complex than a
dog's while a dog's will be much better than a tree's which will be much
better than a piece of rocks' and so on."
To summarize, I believe DQ is best described as pure, preconceptualized
experience. This experience differs in quality (it IS different quality).
David, does this clear me of the solipsism charge? (By the way I agree that a
few others went WAY over the line --they were "hanging ten" so to speak, but I
will let them deal with that issue)
Now to the QE and the creation of patterns:
Mary recently wrote:
"To me, the Quality Event at the inorganic and biological levels is that
moment when, by sheer bumbling around in the dark, something that works
randomly occurs, is found to have fitness for some purpose, supports the
stability of the larger idea of the environment as it currently exists,
and does not violate the fundamental laws of physics. When those
criteria are met we encounter rightness or Good or Quality."
Physicists have found that reality is best described as fields of pure
potential. Value possibilities collapse or decohere in a value interaction
into subatomic subject/objects. Experience, or value interaction creates a
pattern. A pattern of what? A pattern of experience. A particle that is no
longer being created via experience no longer exists as a pattern ...it is now
a virtual particle of pure potential again.
Sq is a pattern within experience. Stop the experience creating it and the
pattern dissipates. No thing is there. Why? No thing was ever there. Things
are terms for consistent patterns of experiences.
You and I see a chair in the corner. It is there only in the sense that the
experience of it is there. You and I are similarly only there in the sense of
the experience. All patterns are patterns of experience. Sq is made of
patterned DQ.
Using these terms, the laws of physics are descriptions of how value
interactions form patterns. That which doesn't form a pattern does not
survive. It disappears without a trace (traces are patterns). Biology is a
fancy word for complex chemical interactions that allow disequilibrium to form
a feedback loop that locks in pattern maintenance. The other levels emerge in
similar ways....they are emergent patterns of complexities...or higher level
simplicities arising from lower level complexity.
Patterns are fueled by quantum value interaction , which fuels "classical
value interaction which fuels, etc........ Experience gets richer as Patterns
gain freedom and potential. But now it isn't the unpatterned freedom and
potential of quantum fields, it is now pattern freedom and experience. Unity
arises. As Dq becomes sq, sq becomes DQ. They are one and the same thing.
They can't exist without each other. Yin and Yang. They are the opposites
that create each other. They are all. Rational Roger becomes Mystic Roger
Rog
PS....I think David was right , but I was afraid to say it earlier......the
universe is growing more conscious and patterns retain what has been learned.
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