Platt and the group,
I had decided to subside into my own understanding of the MoQ but I just
can't learn to keep my mouth shut.
As I said before, I consider Quality to be the driving force for good in
the universe. Not the same as value, good, dynamic quality, etc. According
to me Quality came into existence at the beginning of the universe along
with the physical parameters that also came into existence. Dont ask me
where any of it came from. I haven't got a clue. We just know the universe
is there and we would like to think that it had a beginning. Maybe it
didn't. If that is so that wouldn't make the questions any easier. You pays
your money and you takes your choice. In any case that is my starting point
and don't give me any crap about maybe the universe isn't there at all.
In my view the universe was deterministic from the start and is still
deterministic. The path that produced us is good because there was no
reference point for bad in the universe until humanity (sentience)came
along. Since we evolved from this "good" universe then, as Platt says, we
are embedded in and surrounded by "good".
One of the problems I have with the MoQ is that it seems to me to be
entirely too humancentric. We talk about the levels evolving to a higher
plane as life, sentience, etc, evolved. I think that this is not a correct
way of looking at the human situation. I think that the inorganic level and
the biological level can at times be on a higher value plane than the
social or intellectual levels. I regard the levels not as a gradation of
value but as an intermix of value conflicts which can go either way. In
many cases the social and intellectual levels can operate at a lower value
level than the inorganic and biological levels. Surely some of the needs of
the biosphere should override the desires of humanity.
Mark mentioned the other day about the world population arriving at seven
billion or so this year. Surely there must come a time when we must curb
our own desires and concerns in favor of the health of the inorganic and
biological levels. We are also being told that the mean temperature of the
Earth is rising. Some of this is attributed to a hotter sun but some of it
is attributed to our disturbance of the gaseous envelope of the Earth. It
seems to me that we are approaching a time when the i and b levels will
demand precedence over the s and i levels. I can envision a time when we
will have to rethink our application of the MoQ.
It does not seem reasonable to me that our actions on Earth can have any
effect on the Universe at large but It seems obvious that they can, and
are, affecting the biosphere. Maybe the universe is full of MoQs all busily
plugging away at their own concerns.
Anyway, I just wanted to throw in the idea that our current concept of
the interaction of the levels may not be correct and that all of this
gnashing of teeth over the value interactions between the levels may need
to be rethought. Ken
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