ROGER FINALLY RESPONDS TO GLOVE
My new quotes follow my name in BOLD:
>Glove:
>If the patterns of value we perceive are all intellectual constructs
>by contingency they all respond to DQ.
ROGER:
You seem to have found another way to negate my objections to Pirsig's
statement. As a unified whole, the entire system of DQ, subject and object
are necessary. If one ingredient is missing, the cake won't rise.
>Roger:
>But to clarify, I intuit that Mary's escape from this dilemma is wrong too.
>And I agree that intellectually derived patterns can't respond to DQ. My
>BIG PROBLEMO with Pirsig's statement is that he is neglecting to state that
>"living beings" are static intellectual constructs as well.
>Glove: Hmmm... in the sense that we must recognize "living beings" I would
>say this is correct, yes. Living beings are also static intellect
>constructs. Pattern recognition is how we perceive our world and learn about
>it. But these static intellect patterns come before the external world, not
>after. Doesn't that negate your objection?
ROGER:
I think it would be more accurate to say that arise together as you seem to
imply with your 1st statement, above. In a novel (another intellectual
construct) does the fictional mother come before the fictional daughter?
Isn't it reasonable to assume that they arise together from the mind of the
author. In this case, I see the author as DQ. Now the question is what does
this make us? From a static level, we are the characters of the novel. From
a dynamic level, we are DQ itself. I know this metaphor is getting twisted,
but the MOQ almost explains the world as an autobiography, where the author
and the depiction of the author arise together via the dynamic action of
writing. That is why I have always found similarities between the MOQ and
autopoiesis -- the theory of life and cognition that explains the organism
and its world arising together.
>Roger:
>I never met a solipsistic mystic. ;-)
>Glove: Sounds like lyrics to a song...
ROGER:
I was thinking the same thing as I wrote it. Kind of like Marley meets
Gershwin.
Let me know your thoughts, Dan. And yours too, Platt.
Roger
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