Re: MD Zen, Tao & the MoQ

From: David L Thomas (dlt44@ipa.net)
Date: Mon Jul 19 1999 - 16:56:04 BST


Rich has

> a question or nine:
>
> What are the roles of the Tao and Buddhism, (Zen in particular) in relation
> to the MOQ?
>
> a)Psychologically - perfection, satori, motorcycle maintenance, etc.
>
> b)Epistemologically - what can we know? how?
>
> c)Metaphysically - what can we say *well* about reality?
>
> d)Ethics - i: individual existential moral choices
> ii: international theoretical moral structures/laws
>
> e)Cosmology - the whole kit and kaboodle (Lila)

These are some possible correspondances I've gleaned from "Buddhism without
Beliefs" by Steven Batchelor.

"Broadly speaking, "dharma" refers to the teachings of the Buddha as well as
to those aspects of reality and experience with which his teaching are concerned."

Dharma's "ennobling truths" and RMP's static qualities both number four. They
are also grouped similiarly in two groups of two (anguish and it
origins=dilemma, cessation and the path=resolution vs SOQ+SBQ=objective and SSQ+SIQ=subjective.
Though probably coincidential, mystically who knows.

The workings both systems are similar.

        Buddhism-"each truth requires being acted upon in its own particular
way..These are
        not four separate activities but four phases of within the process..All four
        activities are part of a single continuum of action"
        
        The MOQ- each level has its own morals,laws,codes, etc, but system has
        higher,overiding, interrelationships between levels and DQ. But ultimately
under the
        MoQ reality is a "continumm" of here and now events.

but,

        In Buddhism "Only through knowing these truths,knowing how to act on them, and
        knowing that he has acted upon them can he claim to have found authentic
        awakening"... reality is "an interwoven complex of truths"

        In the MoQ- "Many truths" complexedly interwoven.

Both are experience based:

        Buddhism- [Buddha]"awoke to a set of interrelated truthes rooted in the
        immediacy of experience here and now"

        The MoQ-"Insert your favorite MoQ experience quote here"

Both are grounded in values,morals,ethics:

        Buddhism-"Dharma practice" refers to the way of life undertaken by someone
who is
        inspired by such teachings....It encompasses everthing we do. It is an
authentic way
        of being it the world. It begins with how we understand the kind of reality we
        inhabit and the kinds of beings we are that inhabit such a reality. Such a vision
        underpins the VALUES that inform our ideas, the choices we make, the words we utter,
        the deeds we perform, the work we do. It provides the ETHICAL ground for
mindful and
        focused awareness,.." [my emphasis of values and ethical]

        The MoQ-"Insert your favorite MoQ value quote here"

Neither dwell on the ultimate metaphysical questions: (though Pirisg goes
farther in that direction than the Buddha)

        Buddhism- [Buddha]"When asked about metaphysics(the origin and end of the
        universe,the identity or difference of body and mind, his existence or nonexistence
        after death) he remained silent."

        The MoQ-subscribes to evolutionary scenerio for the beginning of universe but
        is silent on ultimate origin, or life after death, soul,etc except for
mystical nods.

Both use freedom as single greatest overriding moral principle:

        Buddhism- "He said dharma was permeated by a single taste: freedom"
        
        The MoQ-"Insert your favorite MoQ freedom quote here"

But back to the basic question:

> What are the roles of the Tao and Buddhism, (Zen in particular) in relation
> to the MOQ?

Bachelor says "First and foremost the Buddha taught a method (dharma practice)
rather than another "-ism" The dharma is not something to believe in but
something to do. The Buddha did not reveal an esoteric set of facts about
reality, which we can choose to believe in or not"

IMHO, Pirsig,on the other hand, provides "an esoteric set of facts about
reality" which integrate many basic Buddhist concepts and implies that the
Buddha's method is at least a "good" way to juggle these facts. Or he gives
the Western mind "something to believe in" while proposing an Eastern way "to
do something."

But I could be wrong.

Dave

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