I looked over what I said, and it seemed to me that what I was implying is
that randomness is truly subjective, but that the patterns we perceive (:the
world about us) are the subjective impression of some other, objective
reality. But unlike Plato, I'm not saying that the patterns are not true,
just that they're not the 'whole truth'. The patterns we perceive are those
we *can* perceive - they are our 'desciptions' of that other non-subjective
reality, and without developing these 'descriptions' the universe would
indeed seem chaotic. So our world is the product of our mind! is this
solipsim, then?
----- Original Message -----
From: "David Buchanan" <DBuchanan@ClassicalRadio.org>
To: <moq_discuss@moq.org>
Sent: 08 March 2000 06:33
Subject: MD Random Patterns?
> Peter and y'all:
>
> I've only a few minutes, but liked your Monday post and want to squeeze in
a
> few thoughts.
>
> I think you're on to something with random-ness and scale. As I understand
> it, Pirsig is saying that the entire universe in nothing but DQ and static
> patterns. And I think this means there is no such thing as disorder, not
> really. Even the energetic and kenetic movement of gas molecules in a
closed
> chamber are patterned because the molecules themselves ARE patterns of
> static quality. Nothing in creation is without a pattern. You've just got
to
> look at the proper scale to recognize it.
>
> But that oxymoronic topic isn't as interesting as the other point you
> raised...
>
> PETER SAID...
> "I have to defend the notion that many of the patterns that humans are
> interested in are in fact subjective-based, ...yet maintain that "reality"
> is not entirely the product of subjectivity. I can do this by resort to
the
> notion that there exists 'something' objective, without having to claim to
> be able to define it."
>
> DMB
> Well, sure. Not only are humans interested in their point of view, but I
was
> trying desperately to get across the idea the Pirsig doesn't reject
> "subjectiveity", but actually expands it to the lowest levels of creation.
> Subjectivity is a feature of every static pattern. Even sub-atomic
particles
> make choices in the MOQ, no?
>
> And just for the record, Solipsism doesn't just recognize our "interest"
in
> the subjective, it says that the world is CREATED by subjectivity, by
"mind"
> in the classical sense of the word.
MOQ.ORG - http://www.moq.org
Mail Archive - http://alt.venus.co.uk/hypermail/moq_discuss/
MD Queries - horse@wasted.demon.nl
To unsubscribe from moq_discuss follow the instructions at:
http://www.moq.org/md/subscribe.html
This archive was generated by hypermail 2b30 : Sat Aug 17 2002 - 16:00:40 BST