Danila,
Firstly a collection from your great interventions:
> In the MOQ, the Society and
> Intellectual levels are not 'things' with stable properties independent of
> the observer. In practice, they exist only in the value-relationship of
> two real entities.
So I'm not the only one here.....
> What would Intellect do without Society as a laboratory to try out its
> schemes? Aren't many if not most Intellectual schemes ABOUT Society?
> Intellect has a responsibility to have an ongoing relationship with
> Society in order to bring DQ into society.
> As a pragmatist, I'm far more interested in applying the MOQ
> to real-life problems than in staying on the Intellectual level as
> with mathematics. My Intellect is definitely not at war with Society;
> it wants to improve Society.
oh, Danila, where have you been all these times?
> In addition, I think it's really important in discussion to differentiate
> between the entity (society, intellect, etc.) and the value patterns it
> (can) create.
YES!
> even though I agree with Marco that art is just as valuable an
INTELLECTUAl
> value pattern as logical thought (really one is holistic, the other
analytic), in practice
> the INTELLECTUAL value patterns used by political leaders are usually
> philosophies (political, economic, etc.), not art. They rally the people
using artistic
> symbols (Triumph of the Will) but they reorganize society using doctrine
or
> dogma.
> --the kind of people who want to intellectualize society, by using
analytic
> INTELLECTUAL value patterns to change the world, tend to see art,
intuition and
> SOCIAL values as unimportant, for weaklings and women. People who think
> holistically, who value the ability to create art as well as the ability
to think
> logically, who value kind hearts as well as adherence to "the truth", do
not have the
> singleminded drive to impose their INTELLECTUAL values on society by
> weakening SOCIAL values.
My only displeasure is that I would like I had written these words!
___________________________
About the MOQ as prescriptive....
> I am interested in what it has to say about the environmental
> questions where an expanding human population 'needs' to damage or destroy
> an ecosystem to survive. How can ordinary citizens create a consistent
> INTELLECTUAL pattern using the MOQ that would be acceptable to everyone in
> society and preserve the environment?
this is from "The Nature of Natural Law" by Rory Fitzgerald. You can find
the complete essay on the moq.org forum. It's all about the MOQ and its
prescriptive application.
========
"Among the first recorded instances of a 'divine law' held it to be immoral
to graze more than seven sheep per hillock in ancient Palestine. Unbeknownst
to the Palestinian peasants this religious codex simply had the economic and
practical effect of ensuring the sustainable growth of Palestinian society.
(Bertrand Russell, A History of Western Philosophy 1974 :142)
It was in reality an evil act to overpopulate one's hill as if this practice
had become widespread the semi-arid terrain would eventually become desert,
causing the end of Palestinian civilisation.
Therefore, a supposedly divine law had the effect of saving a civilisation.
For an ancient agrarian who could not understand the results of overuse of
land in terms of soil erosion in to future generations, it is insightful to
note that it simply 'felt right' not to do this".
=========
Rory offers one of the most ancient examples of a prescription about
preserving an ecosystem in order to preserve the society. This is IMO a very
archaic example of intellect applied to the lower levels. The Rory's essays
goes on with the evolution of law from the archaic "Divine law" to the
modern "Natural law". Rory concludes:
=========
we can see that the MoQ offers at the very least a fresh perspective on
current natural law theories. I believe it to have a great deal of potential
as a basis for the formulation of a new methodology for natural law. I hope
I have shown it to be a rational system which effectually includes value and
therefore may help bridge the failings of religion and science as a basis
for natural law.
=========
Going back to the ecosystem, IMO it's biological. But as every level lays
upon the lower ones, the ecosystem survival is primarily a social demand,
and therefore an intellectual demand.
Thanks
Marco.
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