Glenn,
Yes, I agree: there is no merit in the idea that a
certain number of people could sit in a circle humming
aum or thinking good thoughts and start bending spoons
and shaping minds. And thanks for calling my attention
to how that would impact the "Am I free or determined?"
debate!
The merit I was referring to is how one person can
"teach" another to think in quality ways, to make
quality choices based on that "right" view of reality
and thereby influence others in quality ways. Would it
take one hundred people to geometrically threshold
their influence around the globe? What criteria could
we use to evaluate whether the influence was good or
bad? How many would it take for the world to experience
a turn around? Good or bad? Don't have even a clue. But
history offers a few clues. And the film "Pay It
Forward" offered one interesting if only fictional way
in which "good" might multiply itself. Some of that
happens every day in real life, of course.
But... my own life has frequently demonstrated how
foolish it can be to pass something of value on to
another--material or non-material. In those cases, my
good intentions resulted in bad results. Another way to
say that is that kindness can be cruelty if people want
sympathy, not solutions. It scared me how easy it is to
enable another person's nonsense and do more harm than
good. In Lila, for example, I was initially perturbed
at the main character (Pirsig?) for not being more
compassionate towards his woman friend. If I understood
Pirsig's philosophy a bit better than I do now (I'm
trying), I might have some other perspective...
Perhaps it is only wishful thinking (mine) that a
critical mass of right thinking, no matter how long it
has been going on, could change the way things are.
History offers a few clues, but history has been used
to "prove" and "disprove" all sorts of things.
Actually, I feel pretty good about the way things
are--I'm just not comfortable with the possibility that
history, years from now, will look back on this
generation as that bunch of people who harvested most
of the rain forests, polluted the air and fouled the
water. Not sure any of that is true, either!
Have a good day...
Oops, belay that. I told a colonel to have a good day
once, and he said "!@#$% I'll have any kind of day I
want!")
Billy Dean
Info@billydee.com
http://www.billydee.com
"It is the journey that enlightens--not the
destination..."
Kwai Chang Caine
----- Original Message -----
From: <gmbbradford@netscape.net>
To: <moq_discuss@moq.org>
Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2001 9:16 PM
Subject: RE: Re: MD Lane and others critique Wilber
> Billy Dean,
>
> >Well, even if Carl did not say that, I bet he would
> >have agreed with its implications. That is perhaps
what
> >he meant by some of the things he did say.
> >
> >And I think I can continue to believe in things I
> >cannot see or explain without being in danger of
them
> >clouding my ability to stay in touch with what I can
> >see and explain. Carl Sagan also said, "Skepticism
and
> >wonder make strange bed fellows but a good marriage,
> >for one must be open to all sorts of ideas but
willing
> >to run them through a rigorous filter..."
>
> I agree. The late great Sagan did a lot to popularize
> science and I agree with most things he said. I did
> question the rigor of his filters occasionally,
however.
> >
> >Well, I have read some of Carl Jung's books, so I
> >suppose ESP is possible--can't say either way. But I
> >first encountered the phrase "critical mass" in a
> >college physics class. It also occurs quite
frequently
> >in the new age literature. Even with that dubious
> >connection, I think the idea of applying critical
mass
> >to consciousness has some merit. What do you think?
>
> By "applying critical mass to consciousness" I take
you
> to mean that a certain number of people (this number
> being a critical threshold) sending thought commands
> subliminally to others would influence their
behaviours.
> No, I can't take this seriously. If this really
> worked you'd think it would be common knowledge by
now,
> wouldn't you? At the very least, it would put a new
> spin on the free will/determinism debate :)
>
> The practice of carrying over a concept like
> "critical mass" from physics (as in the critical mass
of
> plutonium needed to start and maintain a nuclear
reaction)
> to other areas like human consciousness is maybe
useful for
> hypothesis building, but we shouldn't be so seduced
by the
> metaphor that we conclude it must be true. It's this
> "jumping to conclusions" mentality of New Age thought
that
> makes it so dubious.
> >
> >Actually, I found Andre Gide's remark in a book
titled
> >"Where to Now, Columbus" which chronicles our
> >exploration of this planet and space. Good
reading--I
> >recommend it highly.
>
> Well I'll be damned! I might check it out.
> >
> >Thanks for your comments--they were also good
reading,
> >in the best sense of the word...
>
> Thanks, Billy Dean. Take care.
> Glenn
>
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