Re: MD Patronizing attitudes

From: Jonathan B. Marder (jonathan.marder@newmail.net)
Date: Wed Oct 03 2001 - 21:40:46 BST


Hi Sam and all,

JONATHAN
> > The rabbis started forming
> > "schools" of disciples while the temple was still standing.
> > I assume that the striking similarity to the "Academies" set up across
> > the sea were not coincidental. The Jews and the Greeks already knew each
> > other well as trading partners and adversaries.. . .

SAM
> It might be worth untangling a little of the chronology here. My
> understanding is that the main impetus behind the development of the
> rabbinic schools was less a Greek influence (which mainly came after
> Alexander the Great's conquests) than the exile in Babylon and the first
> destruction of a temple in Jerusalem (up to and including 587BCE). That
> temple was then rebuilt before being destroyed by the Romans in 70CE,
which
> left the Rabbinic schools carrying the torch.
>
> Is that right, or am I labouring under false pretences? Seems to me that
the
> Jewish thinkers were independently engaged with all the changes of the
> so-called "Axial age", they weren't passive followers of the Greeks.
>

Sam, you are partly right. After the exile, Cyrus allowed the Jews to build
the Second Temple, which as you note, stood until 70CE - through the years
when Greek influence was at its peak. Alexander passed through Jerusalem
peacefully, and it was not till the second century BCE that full-blown
violence erupted (the Maccabees vs. Antiochus). Supposedly the Maccabees
defeated the forces of Hellenism. However, the Greek influence remained very
strong. There is plenty of archeological evidence for this. Greek colonies
flourished, and the Greek language was in widespread use in Judea in the
latter part of the Second Temple Period. It is during these times that the
Rabbinical academies emerged, notably the schools of Hillel and Shammai
during the first century BCE. This is already a couple of centuries after
Alexander, and long after Plato. I don't know if the Rabbis deliberately
copied Plato's Academy, but the history is such that they may have been
influenced.

Thus, one can argue that Rabbinical Judaism emerged from the influence of
the Greeks on the ancient Jewish world, while Christianity developed a bit
later from the influence of the Jews monotheism on the Greek world.

Jonathan

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