***RAYMOND: I understand that myths are a way of
passing on the moral (social) values of any religion
through the generations, but in the case of Western
religion, these are designed to preserve the religion
itself. Within the Metaphysics of Quality, religious
practice is a static social pattern, and has the
tendency to prevent Dynamic intellectual Quality.***
***ERIN: Raymond I still am not sure why you call it
a Western thing. I need more info than this. I can
see how any social dogmatic belief can prevent dynamic
intellectual quality but it is not limited to
religion. I could see a very free-thinking religious
group help promoting dynamic intellectual quality
too. So I think it is more "dogma" that you are
worried about (rightfully so) but be careful because
it is not limited to religion.***
THE MAIN REASON I'M LIMITING IT TO RELIGION IS SIMPLY
BECAUSE OF THE DISCUSSION TOPIC. I AGREE THAT THERE
ARE MANY OTHER STATIC SOCIAL PATTERNS THAT USE DOGMA,
BUT THAT'S ANOTHER ISSUE. AND WHEN I KEEP MY COMMENTS
DIRECTED TO WESTERN RELIGION, I ONLY DO SO BECAUSE I
HAVE MADE A POINT TO STUDY BOTH EAST AND WEST, AND
WHILE THEY MIGHT SHARE A FEW CASUAL CHARACTERISTICS,
THEY ARE VERY DIFFERENT FROM ONE ANOTHER. I DON'T
WISH TO PREFER ONE OVER THE OTHER, BUT I ALSO AM
TRYING TO AVOID GROUPING THEM TOGETHER. I'M MUCH MORE
FAMILIAR WITH WESTERN RELIGION THAN EASTERN, SO I KEEP
MY COMMENTS LIMITED; I'M DEFINITELY NOT QUALIFIED TO
SPEAK ABOUT THE EAST! AND YES, I HAVE A STRONG FEAR
OF DOGMA, HOW'D YOU KNOW?
***ERIN: The religious practice may be a static social
pattern but I think the creating of myths is a dynamic
intellectual process.***
***ERIN: I hope you didn't take my kleenex joke
seriously I am just kidding around, no harm intended.
Your response here just seems so extreme that you need
to be careful or you will become dogmatic without
religion. Read this again and think of dynamic quality
as your religion, I feel as if you are about to go on
a Crusade, and we have had enough of those don't you
think?***
NO, NO OFFENSE TAKEN, BUT I WAS A BIT WORRIED YOU HAD
GIVEN UP ON ME. SOMETIMES THERE'S A DELAY BETWEEN THE
TIME I LEARN SOMETHING AND THE TIME IT REALLY SINKS
IN... WHAT YOU MENTIONED ABOUT DOGMA IS IMPORTANT,
AND I'M CATCHING MYSELF FALLING INTO THAT TRAP
CONTINUOUSLY. I AM A LITTLE WORRIED ABOUT ONE THING;
THERE'S A FINE LINE BETWEEN LETTING MYTHS TEACH YOU
AND LETTING MYTHS CONTROL YOU. I THINK ITS IMPORTANT
TO DISCOVER WHERE THOSE BOUNDARIES LIE, BUT I HAVE NO
IDEAS AS TO HOW THIS SHOULD BE DONE. BUT IN THE
MEANTIME, I'LL AVOID THE CRUSADES...!
***ERIN: I don't have my copy of ZAMM to look that up
right now but what you are saying reminds me of the
dynamic part about myths. You should deconstruct the
myths of your time and try to reconstruct better ones.
I guess there is a static part that tries to preserve
the old myths and a dynamic parts that tries to create
new ones, would you agree to that?***
YEP, I AGREE. IT'S JUST A LITTLE HARD TO GET USED TO
THE IDEA THAT WHILE WE ARE CONSTANTLY CREATING MYTHS
TO ENHANCE AND ENRICH OUR LIVES, THIS IS A
NEVER-ENDING PROCESS. THE MOMENT WE STOP CHANGING AND
CREATING THEM, THEY BECOME DOGMA.
I THINK WHAT PIRSIG WAS GETTING AT IN THE CHAPTER I
MENTIONED WAS THAT IF WE ATTEMPT TO PUT OUR VIEWS OF
REALITY (IN THIS CASE, STATIC SOCIAL PATTERNS) IN
STONE, WE'RE ONLY INVITING TROUBLE. OUR OUTLOOK ON
LIFE HAS TO BE WILLING TO CHANGE IN ORDER TO MEET NEW
CIRCUMSTANCES; OTHERWISE, THESE NEW IDEAS AND NEW
CIRCUMSTANCES WON'T MAKE ANY SENSE. HE GAVE A TON OF
EXAMPLES FROM HISTORY, AND IN "LILA" HE SPENT TIME
DISCUSSING HOW THIS PROBLEM LED TO MOST OF THE WARS OF
THE 20TH CENTURY.
AS FOR RELIGION, I DON'T WANT TO THINK OF IT AS A GOOD
OR BAD THING. BUT I THINK ITS UNFORTUNATE THAT MOST
RELIGIONS RELY ON THEIR OWN STATIC QUALITY. AND
WORSE, MOST OF THE RELIGIONS THAT HAVE BEEN MORE
DYNAMIC AND WILLING TO ADAPT TO NEW IDEAS ARE DEVOURED
BY THE LARGER, MORE STATIC ONES (THE QUAKERS WERE A
GOOD EXAMPLE.)
-RAYMOND
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