Platt wrote...
I don't have a copy of Wilber's "The Marriage of Sense and Soul" but
presume when he refers to "liberal" in the paragraph you cite above he
is talking about the original meaning of the term--advocates of
individual freedom--as opposed to the meaning in common use today--
advocates for government control of resources and redistribution of
income.
DMB says...
Well, since you asked... The liberal "meaning in common use today", as you
call it, is only a definition of Liberalism as conservatives see it. That's
a straw man invented by the Rush Limbaughs of the world. Obviously this is
not what a liberal would say about Liberalism. You wouldn't much like it if
I were allowed to define your conservatism in such distorted terms. (I used
to be a conservative and so I know that change is possible, but I'm not
holding my breath in your case.) But let me at least say that I think Pirsig
and Wilber are essentially on the same page with respect to politics.
They're both critical of almost everything for much of the same reasons.
Pirsig talks about the mistake of SOM intellectuals to appreciate the social
level and Wilber talks alot about the pre/trans fallacy. These seemingly
unrelated objections are actually connected in lots of interesting ways. But
with respect to your question, I'd say they both seek a way to integrate the
lower levels into the higher ones. You know, transcend AND include them. In
this sense, they both offer something like a reconciliation between today's
conservatism and liberalism. They both seek to preserve what has been gained
in the past and are both therefore more respectful of tradition than your
standard liberal intelllectuals. But it would be wrong to claim that either
of them is making a case for conservatism. In fact, they are both very harsh
on reactionaries, fundamentalists and authoritarians of all stripes.
Now I'll insert some extra Wilber for those who might be interested. Here
are the paragraphs that preceed and follow the section you asked about...
The parenthetical insert and emphasis are Wilber's....
"The state cannot in any way advocate or legislate in favor of this
spiritual Enlightenment. The state must stay out of the business of publicly
legislating the Good life, which belongs to the private sphere of each
individual's own choice. The only possible way to integrate these two
demands is to realize that the summum bonum of the Good life lies not on
this, but on the other, side of the political liberalism of the
Enlightenment. That is, spiritual or transrational awareness is
trans-liberal awareness, not pre-liberal awareness. It is NOT REACTIONARY
and REGRESSIVE, it is EVOLUTIONARY and PROGRESSIVE("progressive" being one
of the common terms for "liberal").
> Emphasis is Wilber's...
> "Thus, genuine spiritual experience (or spiritual Enlightenment) as it
> displays itself in the political arena is not prerational mythic belief
but
> rather as transrational awareness, which, BUILDING ON THE GAINS OF LIBERAL
> RATIONALITY AND POLITICAL LIBERALISM, extends those freedoms from the
> political to the spiritual sphere. Thus, spiritual or transrational
> awareness accepts the general tenets of rational political liberalism (not
> prerational mythic reactionism), but then, within those freedoms, pursues
> spiritual Enlightenment in its own case; and through the powers of
advocacy
> and example, encourages others to use their liberal freeedom - the
> Enlightenment of the West - in order to persue spiritual freedom - the
> Enlightenment of the East." KW 212
"The result, we might say, is a liberal Spirit, a liberal God, a liberal
Goddess. In common with TRADITIONAL LIBERALISM, this stance agreees that the
state shall not legislate the Good life. But with TRADITIONAL CONSERVATISM,
this stance places Spirit - and all its manifestations - at the very heart
of the good life, a Good life that therefore includes relationships in all
domains, from family to commmunity to nation to globe to Kosmos to the Heart
of the Kosmos itself, by an other name, God. (Traditional consevatism is in
many important ways anchored in premodern world views - from mythic religion
to civic humanism - whereas liberalism is largely anchored in the rational
differentiations of modernity. Thus the integration of premodern religion
with the differentiationss of modernity would open up the possiblity of a
significant reconsiliation of conservative and liberal views. See THE EYE OF
SPIRIT for further discussion of this theme.)"
DMB...
I hope that helps - somebody.
Platt...
I make this presumption based on Wilber's other writings where he
takes modern day liberals, such as the feminists and the greenies, to
task.
DMB...
Yea, I bet you like those passages best and ignore the rest. Like I said
before, I think your political prejudices distort your understanding of the
MOQ and I suppose it effects your take on Wilber too. Wilber's criticism of
progressive forces ought not be construed as anything other than his attempt
to refine them and save them, to correct the flaws and mistakes, just as
Pirsig's MOQ is a correction for intellectual values. To construe either of
them as liberal bashers or conservative boosters is nothing more than
wishful thinking and psychological projection on your part.
Platt, I think you'll never understand political philosophy properly as long
as you equate liberalism with tyranny. In spite of the demonization of
liberalism by anti-intellectuals and reactionaries, liberalism's aim is
individual freedom, which is the same thing you wish for. Or so you say.
That's why both Wilber and Pirsig can talk about liberal progress as an
expansion of freedom. That's why Wilber mentions the abolition of slavery
and feminism both as progressive movements. Ghandi ain't Stalin.
But, I could be wrong.
Platt
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