Very Dear Wim,
I may be able to answer your questions one day.
However, I'm not sure what progress (objectively
speaking, that we can both agree on) nor which society
you have in mind. Also :o) you do have a lot of
questions (just like me) but I like mine fired at me
one at a time.
André
--- Wim Nusselder <wim.nusselder@antenna.nl> wrote: >
Dear André,
>
> Let me rephrase my question:
> You wrote 27/5 16:18 +0100:
> 'Society is making material progress and spiritual
> regress. ...
> Many countries define progress using Gross National
> Product and not Gross
> National Happiness (like Bhutan).'
>
> Would you care to compare your distinctions
> material/spiritual progress and
> GNP/GNH with Pirsig's distinctions between static
> and Dynamic quality and
> between the different levels of static quality (in
> order to make clear what
> could be the relevance to discussion about a MoQ of
> your distinctions)? I
> fail to see a similarity. If you are not very
> careful, your distinctions may
> even be more similar to the
> object/subject-distinction which Pirsig tried to
> deprive of its metaphysical status...
> My distinctions between primary and secondary social
> and intellectual
> progress might be a way out. I associate material
> progress with secondary
> biological progress (survival of species, of
> biological patterns of values)
> and primary social progress (subservient to the
> value of survival of
> biological patterns of values) and spiritual
> progress with an attempt at
> primary progress beyond the intellectual level
> (subservient to improvement
> and support of -selected- intellectual patterns of
> values). I'd say that
> there's missing something between material and
> spiritual progress (my
> secondary social, primary intellectual and secondary
> intellectual progress),
> just as something's missing between objective
> reality (inorganic plus
> biological reality) and subjective reality
> (intellect as the realm of ideas)
> according to my MoQ: social reality, the realm of
> unconscious longing for
> social status and of copying of behavior that gives
> that status.
> GNP measures an aspect of social status; GNH
> measures (I hope) all static
> quality that people can experience.
>
> I think this type of analysis is necessary to find
> out WHY you experience
> spiritual regress (even while lots of movements and
> organizations
> emphasizing spirituality flourish...) and how to
> remedy that regress.
>
> With friendly greetings,
>
> Wim
>
>
>
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