From: pacodegallo@attbi.com
Date: Sat Oct 26 2002 - 22:52:43 BST
David,
Here is the last of the thread...
You asked a series of biased questions to show that
conservatives have often sacrificed freedom and rights
for other reasons. My responses were basically
agreements with minor qualifications and some minor
extensions to liberals. I then ask you a biased series
of questions to show that liberals (or at least extreme
liberals) are just as guilty, and read your and my
answers...
Yours reads like a list of rationalizations and half-
hearted denials. They basically come down to "Yes, we
did poop all over rights and freedoms but we had a
really good reason," or "No, er, OK, well... we may
indeed have done this but it is for a different reason
than you think." Or, the ever-capable "Maybe so, but
you can't even comprehend why."
I could spend hours on the various ways you dodged the
questions, introduced distortions of the truth, used
denial by redefinition (roughly paraphrased as "we
don't blame the US, we blame her policies" or "we don't
support totalitarianism, we just don't support
eliminating it -- but for good reasons!"), dismissed
the intellectual and moral honesty of those that
disagree with you, and rationalized millions of deaths
as "good ideas gone bad." But, I will let your actual
words stand to represent just how unbiased and
intellectually inspired your ideology is.
7) Who supported a corrupt N. Vietnamese government
that violently conquored those to the South, killing
more people in the establishment of the totalitarian
state than occured during the entire war, and leading
to the impoverishment of a generation?
Paco:
Extreme Liberals.
David:
No. American liberals opposed the war because they are
against
colonialism and because, according to international
law, every nation has
the right to self-determination. And they don't go
along with the sentiment
that "the only good commie is a dead commie". They
didn't believe Vietnam is
a threat to us, a fact which is pretty obvious today.
8) Who blames the US for 9/11 and prefers theocratic,
anti-feminist, homophobic totalitarian governments over
armed liberation?
P:
Extreme liberals
D:
What are talking about!? Liberals don't blame America,
they only
insist that there is a larger context in which the
motives of the terrorists
should be seen, and that context has to do with US
foriegn policies. To
construe this as any kind of support for theocracy or
totalitarianism is
bizzare. This only shows that you don't understand
liberalism at all.
9) Who supports nationalizing vast swaths of free
enterprise industry and freezing prices?
P:
Liberals (and Nixon)
D:
Again, what the heck are you talking about? Nobody is
even TALKING
about nationalizing anything.
10) Who supports the restriction of of property rights
to protect snail darters?
P:
Liberals
D:
Liberals don't buy the argument that the EPA is some
kind of tyrannical
monster. And its not so much about protecting snail
darters, although
endangered species is part of the issue. Instead,
enviromental protections
are aimed at human health. Its a big picture thing.
11) Who wants to restrict freedom of choice on health
care (by adding fringe coverages and/or socializing
it)?
P:
Liberals
D:
As liberals see it, a single payer system would give
provide access
to medicine to millions who presently have none at all.
They only people
opposed to this are the wealthy, the vested interests
who profit handsomely
from the present system and those who've been duped by
them.
12) Who is trying to indoctrinate children that Western
Society is founded on the principle of oppression,
rather than on freedom and rightful liberty?
P:
Extreme liberals
D:
No, liberals want students to learn the whole story,
not just the
Rockwellian fairy tales that make us feel good about
ourselves. Liberal
intellecuals want REAL history to be taught, the good
and the bad, not just
the myths of our national religion.
13) Who stood behind Marxism as it impoverished
generations and led to some of the worst attrocities of
the century?
P:
Liberals
D:
Now this is almost true. American Communists of the
1930's did
refuse to believe what Stalin was doing in Russia,
which was a betrayal of
Marxist principles. As Trotsky said at the time from
exile in Mexico, Stalin
was not a Marxist, he was just a criminal despot.
I'm convinced. Where can I get my ACLU card?
Paco
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