XCTO REMEMBERS HIS JOKE
In the below message, I wrote about the problem of knowing directly about
Islam due to the remote nature of the people who practice it in the Middle
East(though this applies to anything). We are limited in the media of which
we learn (video, books, tv, etc.). I wanted to show this by pointing to what
you could learn about me, a big sports fan, by some of the things that
surrounds the activities I do.
I'll start the day wearing gaudy clothes that that mismatched colors and large
numbers and logos that advertise some product. Then grab the local fishwrap
and read the latest stats on all my favorite warrior factions. Looking at the
advertisements, the observer would note that I probably loved computers, golf
clubs, was losing my hair, frequented strip bars, and needed a penile implant.
I'd then paint my face to imitate the colors of my clan and then proceed in my
chariot to roast and drink in an asphalt stable. Later, thoroughly
inebriated, join the procession to the Coloseum.
There's a lot of exaggeration, but....
What does that really tell you about sports fans???
=======================================================
In a message dated 11/13/98 12:04:22 PM Pacific Standard Time, Xcto writes:
<< Subj: Re: MD Moslem/Western
Date: 11/13/98 12:04:22 PM Pacific Standard Time
From: Xcto
To: moq_discuss@moq.org
XCTO AGREES WITH BODIVAR'S THOUGHTS ON MOQ RISING ABOVE INTELLECT AND EXPANDS
ON EAST/WEST THINKING. ALSO FORESHADOWS SECRET IDENTITY.
first in the footnote xcto talks about the pros and cons of Buddhism today.
a reflection on america follows. Second, repost on the idea that the MOQ is
the fifth level.
_____________________________________________________________________
In a message dated 11/13/98 9:52:48 AM Pacific Standard Time,
skutvik@online.no writes:
<< Footnote:
>Why the struggle is not West vs East, and on Buddhism:
> According to Pirsig the (Far) East has understood - and
>resolved - the Dynamic/Static split long before it became an issue in
>the West [still only in our small group :-(]. Buddhism solves the
>dynamic/static problem ....to the Easterner ..... but Western mind
>with its subject-object fixation cannot make it over the "gap".The
>dynamic/static tends to become the idealist/materialist and seen thus
>it messes it all up. Not even all of our group understand this either
>(Hi Donny :-)) >>
Yes, I see that, and I also see that the Buddhism (especially Zen) is based
on a very rigid Static Social Level. What I'm refering to is the very caste-
like social systems in India and Japan which are just recently being changed
(even in Japan). This restriction of freedom is close to anti-intellectualism
because it only allows it to a small group. I think it goes back to the
Eastern idea that no matter what we know, the words we say can never describe
reality, let alone the ONE.
And when you talk about idealism/materialism, don't forget to think about
classicism/romanticism and the cult of personality of popular culture that
rules most of people's life (Pirsig & Redford). And think of how in our
culture society is winning over intellect on several fronts ("Dumb and
Dumber", "Jerry Springer", "Real Life Home Video", Jesse "the mind" Ventura!!!
etc.). Is this an example of western thought or just America????
>I think Xcto joins me in my test balloon: the Quality idea as a first
>stirring of Dynamic Quality trying to free itself from Intellect's
>constraints. Seen in this context the MOQ "supports" Social values
>...in the same way as Intellect supports Biology in its struggle with
>Society.
Several people have alluded to this idea of Quality trying to free itself
from the grip of Intellect. And for the most part, intellect has been
nonplussed to the idea (reading the critiques of LILA). But Intellect always
has tried to be impartial in terms of the diversity of cultures and ideologies
saying one is as good as another. And Intellect has not been able to
convincingly "intellectualize" answers to seemingly conventional social
problems - examples, death penalty, euthanasia, abortion, etc. on a universal
basis. We all agree that freedom is the most dynamic accomplishment of the
Intellectual level. What we are looking for is morality of the intellectual
level. Do we argue the morality of someone murdering or raping someone? no
it's not at the social/biological that we are ever discussing morality (though
we find many analogies there). It's always the intellectual/society interface
or the intellectual's disregard for the social patterns.
I think I misrepresented myself in the Islam question when I gave the
impression that Islam is of lower moral value. My thought was that Islam has
nothing to do with improving Intellectual Quality. It can very well improve
Social Quality if America could dynamically add some of it's ideals to our
society. But who knows anything about Islam? What are you going to do, watch
"Raiders of the Lost Ark"'s Egypt scene or "Ishtar?" What we see about Islam
and what is true is the same as what we see on popular TV and what is true
about America.
Going back to MOQ as the fifth level, we often hear about "universal values"
and the fact that they do exist. Responsibility, Caring, Family,
Trust(integrity), Respect,...these are universal in all Social Static
Patterns. And in some way you can apply them to each level of the MOQ. We
bandy about terms like purpose and caring, but I think it has to do with the
fifth level. I argued before that prior to 500BCE the social and intellectual
levels were indistinguishable and some quote from LILA was about that fact.
Even more so we are in a time where intellectual and the fifth level are
indistinguishable. But I believe it will not always be so. I think the Fifth
level will be about Universal Morality and respect for ideological and
cultural diversity that everyone can live with. I hope it won't be 2500 years
before we find out. Unless findunne is right....or those damn new agers
('universal harmony' my ass).
I had a damn funny joke I was going to put in about above but I forgot it
while writing the closing. oh well
Xcto (whose real name is an office supply)
>>
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