In a message dated 5/26/99 8:39:28 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
DBuchanan@ClassicalRadio.org writes:
> If the mythos is "the main stream, the whole
> body of every idea that ever existed or can exist which each culture
> selects from," then how is it different from the intellectual level? I
> mean myths and legends operate on an unconscious social level and help to
> inform the language, but they aren't really ideas in usual sense of the
> word. It where ideas come from to be sure, but it seems the mythos is
> not intellectual per se. Its more basic than that, isn't it?
"All of philosophy is a footnote to Plato" -???who said that???
You are right, David, Mythos is very different from the intellectual level.
Mythos contrasts with the term Logos, which I'll define as our description of
reality and thought (it's not but it's convenient). I took this concept from
a book "Early Greek Philosophers" where it talked about the naturalistic
philosophies of the early Greek thinkers. Mythos governs ideas the same way
we move through time...only seeing in hindsight; our ideas only come from the
wake of the intellectual patterns we are from. I would take apart Pirsig's
comments and put it into four parts.
"The main stream" - Mythos is the generative 'stream' which we are but a
tributary of static Subjective(social/intellectual) thought patterns.
I believe Pirsig considers Western thought as an extension of an ancient
cultural pattern, the one that thought up 'rt' in Lila. And obviously his
ideas on what is quality or virtue stem from here as well. But obviously
these are "ideas" in themselves but note that they are without an
intellectual structure to contain the shared concept. - it's the mythos.
"[Mythos is]...the whole body of every idea that ever existed" This is the
part which makes me also think of all of the Intellect level. I believe it
does not mean the ideas themselves, but how our ideas are a growth in
Subjective patterns that originates from a mythos source. Separate cultures
have different Subjective patterns that lead to different thoughts as
offspring. What I'm trying to say is that for the static patterns, the ideas
of the Zuni Indians are an intellectual level and those of Western Thinkers
are an intellectual level and they are DIFFERENT (everyone please comment
here! I'm saying Intellect might have discrete divisions) but both are
branches that stem from the common mythos.
"or can exist" - I believe Pirsig is saying that cultures are limited in
their Dynamic growth by strong social and intellectual patterns that does not
allow complete freedom without going insane.
"which each culture selects from, calling its own selection 'reality' - When
a culture selects a particular view, any view outside is not real...it's all
in your head. And we all have problems seeing things outside our 'reality.'
Read Pirsig's letter again and you'll see that, DB. It's not the
intellectual level, but getting away from it towards DQ. For you Casteneda
fans out there it's tonal and nagual. logos and mythos.
And as a final note...people stepping out of common culture patterns is
happening more and more I believe with the dissemination of information and
the disassociation people are having with their own cultural patterns.
Columbine was just another Lila story.
Hey there,
Xcto
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