Re: MD Can Only Humans Respond to DQ?

From: Mari (mld2001@adelphia.net)
Date: Tue Dec 03 2002 - 13:24:43 GMT

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    Trivik wrote:
    > metaphours cause muddles.
    > after i have learnt to swim i should foreverafter take the float along
    > with me into the pool?
    >
    > > Yoda says: " 'Try' NOT Luke. Do or do NOT. There is no "try".
    > ouh...so long as one does not know who is who there will be attempts in
    > place of actions. Like if one does something that involves someone else
    > and they turn out to be a lila it may end up being just an attempt.
    ********************************************
    dictionary.com says:
    met·a·phor ( P ) Pronunciation Key (mt-fôr, -fr)
    n.
    A figure of speech in which a word or phrase that ordinarily designates one
    thing is used to designate another, thus making an implicit comparison, as
    in "a sea of troubles" or "All the world's a stage" (Shakespeare).
    One thing conceived as representing another; a symbol: "Hollywood has always
    been an irresistible, prefabricated metaphor for the crass, the
    materialistic, the shallow, and the craven" (Neal Gabler).

    Mari says: it is obvious that a metaphor can say just about anything one
    comes up with in their mind. You have illustrated well, using metaphor
    itself, how metaphor can makes non-sense ( IMHO) But i'm not going to
    through the baby out with the bath water.
    i am interested in what you are saying. Even here i wouldn't say that you
    are "trying to say", you are "saying" something but i am not clear what it
    is? That metaphors can be bad? That they are not perfect in all ways all
    the time? That you have a problem with Yoda? With this particular metaphor?
    With me? i do not know for sure what you mean.
     i do like the "try NOT....." metaphor for a number of reasons. Probably
    first and foremost is this: i think all too often human beings set
    themselves up to fail by comforting themselves with the notion of "trying",
    that "trying" is a good thing under all circumstances and in all ways. i do
    not think that. i think it runs in the background of our sub-conscious mind
    because we set it up to be there as an excuse for not doing whatever we say
    is too difficult or that we just do not want to say NO or YES to. It's a cop
    out word more often than most people realize......i think that "try" can be
    a form of excusable failure: "I tried to do my homework Mrs. Crabtree but
    there just wasn't enough time...." ( bad excuse)
     as well as:
    "I tried to put out the fire but a garden hose and my will were no match for
    the tanker fire" ( good excuse )

    i remember reading an article in Omni magazine about computers playing a
    chess master ( don't recall which master) At the time no computer had ever
    won against a human chess master. The challenge went out to colleges and
    companies who wanted to compete against the human chess master. In the end
    man won. Some of the matches lasted hours perhaps even days. IBM's Big Blue
    was one the strongest competitors. What stood out to me was the writers
    comment that in his opinion the really smartest computer ( there was only
    one that did this ) would quit the moment it realized that there was no way
    it could win.
    i suppose we can agree that all the computer started out with the purpose of
    winning a chess game. We could probably agree that all competitors were
    "trying" to win in a manner of speaking. And maybe we can even agree that
    there are varying degrees of "trying". But somewhere we disagree on
    something....we are not grokking that's for sure.
    Like that one computer, i know there will come a point when quitting is a
    better choice than "trying" for me. i'm not there yet.

    Mari

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