Re: MD Is the MoQ still in the Kantosphere?

From: Sam Norton (elizaphanian@kohath.wanadoo.co.uk)
Date: Thu Dec 09 2004 - 22:40:41 GMT

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    Hi Joe,

    thanks for the response, but would you be able to unpack things a bit more. Specifically:

    > joe: IMO no! Schleiermacher's schema has roots in a division between
    > mind-will-soul and matter. The term 'immediate consciousness' used by Grace
    > Jantzen reflects the presence of a mind- will-soul.

    Please do explain how "Schleiermacher's schema has roots in a division between mind-will-soul and
    matter". You're probably right, but it isn't immediately obvious why.

    > IMO following the MOQ's
    > description of experience, DQ/SQ, Quality has evolved the levels and the
    > emanations between dq/sq is mystical experience of the levels.

    You'll need to unpick that sentence a bit more before I can understand it. Although part of my
    argument is that 'the MOQ's description of experience' is basically Kantian.

    > In The Edge
    > of Chaos Mark M uses the term 'sweet spot'. For me this is a description of
    > the emanation of coherence between sq and sq.

    I agree that it was a useful essay but I can't see the relevance to this thread.

    > joe: it is true that No man is an island! IMO the academic community has not
    > fully explored the MOQ so what it says about Schleiermacher is irrelevant.

    That's a non sequitur. Surely the argument is that because academia hasn't explored the MoQ, what it
    says about the MOQ is irrelevant. Whereas, because they have explored Kant and Schleiermacher, they
    should be listened to on them. And if I am right in saying that the MoQ parallels Schleiermacher,
    then some of their criticisms will correspondingly apply. Make sense?

    > A
    > description of a 'direct borrowing' by Pirsig from Schleiermacher would not
    > return value for value.

    Well, that's not what I was arguing for. The issue is the conceptual shape - see above.

    Thanks for taking the time to read it.

    Sam

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