From: Phaedrus Wolff (PhaedrusWolff@carolina.rr.com)
Date: Sat Jan 08 2005 - 15:13:50 GMT
Chin earlier)What I believe is that this mystical experience does come from
> the mind, in that it is intuitive.
Platt)I also believe mystical experience is intuitive since it is what we
experience before we put anything into words.
Chin)Such as in DQ?
Platt)For me intuition is an endlessly fascinating subject because, as you
indicate it remains largely a mystery. From what I've read, some of it is
due to the silent workings of our subconscious. But as you say, it may
also come from some outside source Whatever. I don't think to know
mystical experience requires that we enter a monastery for a period of Zen
training or that we practice Yogi meditation. It's there, right in front
of us for all to "see" if we pay attention to its silent promptings.
Chin)First let me apologize for not getting to this earlier, as I was rushed
and just skimming through the emails, I missed this one.
If you have read of this intuition, I would like to get a philosophical view
of it since I have not devoted much time to it. All that I remember reading
has only been a hint of what I would think intuition would mean. For a
philosopher, it would mean knowing the color red, or a blind man knowing
light(?)
Where this starts to get foggy is like with the Native American who thinks
of intuition as a connection with their ancestors, or maybe one of the
original philosophers such as Socrates, who saw his intuition as reasoning,
but claimed divine intervention. Then you have Nostradamus, Galileo, and
Einstein. What about the Buddha?
Then you have my youngest son, who at the age of 11 could take a power
steering pump, alternator, or water pump off my truck and replace them with
no prior experience, help or instruction; who could not do school work, but
score the highest in his school on the end of grade tests.
What about the other students, who may make 3.9s and 4.0s on Math, but fail
English Lit, or vice versus?
I see this also in my online classes, seminars, and discussion boards on
finance. The folks I have worked with are brilliant and some highly
accredited, but they just don't get finance (in my view). I have also seen
this in other fields, but have not advanced myself far enough to draw a
conclusion.
Where would you separate intuition from experience? It would seem to me that
this intuition would fit well into Quality, or the leading edge of the
train. What Shaw calls the 'Ready-mades' and 'Hand-me-downs' might be the
same as what Pirsig calls philosophology(?), or static patterns.
In order to advance in metaphysical thinking, does it not require an
independent view to some extent? -- as you say, " . . . before we put
anything into words."
It would seem to me that a fair explanation of intuition would be the
cumulative knowledge we have gained since the Greeks, or Buddha, or
ancestors built up into us through our minds dissected, inspected, rejected
and injected to a point that we have a better understanding of individual
views of our ancestors as individual components of our thinking processes
just as the philosophology plays a part in our developing our own
independent philosophy, and past scientific experimentation would lend to
our current scientific experimentations.
Where this might fit in with the MOQ would be this DQ as the leading edge.
In chaos, evolution would be the cumulative knowledge of the inorganic
patterns advancing, just as the cumulative knowledge would advance our
intellect. Maybe the high intellect we recognize now did not just begin in
the last century as some have claimed, but has been developing since the
beginning of time on earth, and has just mushroomed, and possibly has only
begun to mushroom.
Maybe this is why Shaw saw fit to write "A Treatise on Parents and Children"
stating that we need to offer ourselves up as an example of what our
children should 'Not' be.
Is it possible our children are born with software built into the brain
beyond our inductive reasoning capabilities? Is it also possible through
genetics or ancestors that some are born with a higher degree of inductive
reasoning capabilities than others?
I have much to discuss on this, but my main thought on this is that we do
not advance from a total acceptance of the 'Ready-mades' and 'Hand-me-downs'
of the Bricks and Mortar Universities. We must look within as well.
I'll shut down my ramblings for now. :o)
Chin
----- Original Message -----
From: "Platt Holden" <pholden@sc.rr.com>
To: <moq_discuss@moq.org>; <owner-moq_discuss@venus.co.uk>
Sent: Friday, January 07, 2005 11:51 AM
Subject: Re: MD Universal Moral Standards
> Hi Chin,
>
>
> > What I believe is that this mystical experience does come from
> > the mind, in that it is intuitive.
>
> I also believe mystical experience is intuitive since it is what we
> experience before we put anything into words.
>
> For me intuition is an endlessly fascinating subject because, as you
> indicate it remains largely a mystery. From what I've read, some of it is
> due to the silent workings of our subconscious. But as you say, it may
> also come from some outside source Whatever. I don't think to know
> mystical experience requires that we enter a monastery for a period of Zen
> training or that we practice Yogi meditation. It's there, right in front
> of us for all to "see" if we pay attention to its silent promptings.
>
> Thanks for your most interesting response.
>
> Best,
> Platt
>
>
>
>
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