Re: MD Nihilism (Punk)

From: Arlo J. Bensinger (ajb102@psu.edu)
Date: Sat Mar 26 2005 - 15:06:20 GMT

  • Next message: Platt Holden: "MD The Schiavo Case"

    And round and round and round Platt goes, why he doesn't read what Arlo writes,
    no one knows...

    Last time around, Platt made some "sleuthy" observations about what I've been
    saying. Never mind that I responded to each, and raised questions back. Or
    already addressed what he thinks he can "catch me" on here. Here we are right
    back to "proving rock is biological and about sex".

    You see, with Platt, its always "purely dichotomous" and "universally
    generalized" and "universally immoral". It is against THESE things that I have
    been critical, as they are logically vapid positions.

    To resum Platt's charges, briefly state my response, and then respond to Platt's
    latest attempt to "prove" his point by offering a list of quotes:

    (1) "All rock is degenerate" because it either (a) contains sexual themes, (b)
    promotes promiscuity, or (c) has "the beat of sexual intercourse".

    Problems: Platt excempts other music and genres from this charge regardless of
    being confronted with songs that meet his "degenerate" criteria with "rock". He
    says, for example, that rock is degenerate for promoting promiscuity, but
    Sinatra, who's music inspired more "teen sex" and promiscuity than The Clash
    ever did, is perfectly non-degenerate.

    (2) "Artistically superior" music can contain either (a) sexual themes (Peggy
    Lee), (b) promotion of promiscuity (Sinatra), or (3) the "beat of sexual
    intercourse" (Ravel).

    Problem: "Artistically superior" and "what Platt likes" are synonymns. Since
    music is excempted from the original Big Three degeneracies (a,b,c above) that
    has these components, the "true" argument Platt is making is "Music I don't
    like is artistically inferior and thus degenerate".

    (3) "Artistically superior" has been dichotomously defined as "classical" versus
    "rock".

    Problem: Platt continues to offer why other "lesser" genres (Salsa, Polka,
    Swing, Bluegrass, Country, Reggae, etc.) that contain one or more of his Big
    Three are excempt from his rage. For example, Salsa and Tango have long been
    criticized for their overt sexual messages and sexual dances (I'll get to this
    more below), why are these "not degenerate". What about Bluegrass or Country,
    which parallels the same "beat" as rock?

    (4) If Arlo supports "rock" it means he (a) denies that some rock is very
    sexual, and (b) supports hippie free love and uncritical biological Quality.

    Problem: If Platt would read my posts, just once, he would see that I have
    repeatedly stated that my criticisms stemmed from his indefensible
    generalization about "all rock". In Platt's dichotomous world, the only two
    options are "all rock is sexual" or "all rock is not sexual". There certainly
    are sexual songs, from Peggy Lee to KISS, from Ravel to Pete Pablo. Also, I
    state that I find nothing inherently offensive about all sexual songs. Some I
    find disgusting (Pete Pablo), some I find enjoyable (Modern English). While
    Platt would univerally condemn everything "sexual", I believe a lot of it is
    enjoyable and perfectly moral.

    (5) Rock "causes" immorality.

    Problem: This is as idiotic as saying "Classical music CAUSES morality". Art, in
    this case music, is reflective and/or expressive, not causal. The songs I do
    find "degenerate" I see as reflective of larger socio-economic,
    socio-political, and socio-communal problems. I mentioned poverty last time
    around (as one factor), which Platt conservatively ridiculed. Which leaves
    Platt making the statement: "Poverty does not cause social decay, rock music
    does." Isn't that right, Platt?

    Finally, Platt offers a long list of quotes in defense of his "all rock music is
    sexual" argument. I won't reprint them. But, again, it's funny that Platt feels
    he can "catch me" admitting some rock (or jazz, or salsa, or tango, or swing,
    or classical) is sexual. It is, so what?

    But let me use this opportunity to "force" an issue. A quick search of the web
    (I'll let Platt undertake this as an exercise in critical inquiry) reveals just
    as many "quotes" that say that Salsa music and/or Tango is "sexual".

    Platt, does this "prove" that salsa and tango are "degenerate"?

    > Of course, according to Arlo, anyone with any of the views expressed above is
    narcissistic, obsessive, idiotic, vapid, foolish, nonsensical,
    > laughable, tricky, stupid and otherwise deserving of contempt. Be not
    > surprised -- ad hominem argument comes naturally to those on the left.

    No, anyone expressing (1) univeral generality about "all rock", (2) excempting
    "artistically superior" (i.e., "what Platt likes") sexual music, (3)
    universally condemning sexual themes as "immoral" simply because they promote
    biological Quality, and (4) saying that "poverty doesn't cause social decay,
    rock music does", I find holding narcisstic and vapid positions.

    But I think a hefty toast is in order. I never thought I'd see the day when
    Platt quotes Malcolm McLaren. Prost!!

    Arlo

    PS: Knew you'd come back to them "liberals". I'm frankly surprised you haven't
    tried to equate "rock music" with liberalism. Which is absurd, of course, since
    the largest consumers of "rock" are the red states. Plus, personally, the
    "liberals" I know are more likely to listen to jazz and classical than my
    "conservative" blue-collar friends. Come on up to Schuylkill Haven and try to
    play "classical", you're "girly boy" butt would be kicked out of the county.
    Toby Keith and Led Zeppelin are what rules in Haven, an nearly complete
    Bush-town. But, I'm sure you'll try to make the connection anyway...

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