From: Platt Holden (pholden@sc.rr.com)
Date: Wed Apr 27 2005 - 20:51:09 BST
Hi All,
The following letter from Jon was sent to me because for some reason he
couldn't get it posted on the site. I will try to forward it to the site in
this manner. Platt
I am reading a lot of over-exaggeration. The true intellectuals will
continue to be intellectuals however they see fit no matter who the
president of the United States is. One post I read actually indicated that
one day in the not-too-distant future the intellectuals were going to be
herded into concentration camps. Absurd.
Pat Robertson isn't evil or powerful. The United States upheld Larry
Flynt's right to make fun of Pat. Enough said.
Comparing the Christian church of today with the era of the Crusades is as
stupid as comparing the 1972 Miami Dolphins to the 1999 Miami Dolphins. One
had a perfect season, one didn't make it to the playoffs. They are not the
same people having the same effect, and the world around them is vastly
different.
Yes, the church of today is insensitive to certain issues. But saying a
group of people are damned is clearly different from rounding that group up
and killing them. Just because the "official" position of the church is
against certain intellectual endeavors doesn't change the fact that these
endeavors will continue. Stem cell research will continue. I have faith in
the dynamic drive of mankind. The people who have the most passion for
ANYthing in life will find a way to do it. Despite the rampant Bush hatred,
he is still the first POTUS to officially endorse stem cell research. That
is evolution. To say otherwise is to deny the truth. Any progress is more
moral than zero progress.
Let us also point out that before the civil war, many Christians preached
against the institution of slavery, and indeed helped many slaves escape.
The abolitionists movement in America was almost totally Christian. And a
predominantly Christian army liberated the Jews from the concentration
camps. And the work of Christian missionaries this very day and age should
be admired by anyone who values charity and compassion. These Christians
visit kids in poor countries Iraq and even North Korea and visit the
hospitals and gives the kids toys and I've seen the kids eyes lite up
hearing that someone cares, that someone is doing something special for them
and telling them a power greater than mankind cares for them. That is not
the work of people intent of dragging society into the dark ages. Any moron
with half a brain knows that only a sliver of a fraction of believers
actually are TRULY anti intellectual, such as the Amish, shunning technology
and so forth.
When you talk about fanatics, your criticism is misplaced when you focus on
suburban christains. These people are not going out murdering or
evangelizing every stranger they see on the street. They don't chant
"death to Muslims!" in church gatherings. In short, they are no cold
blooded, or even warm blooded, killers. It seems to me that if you are
going to worry about fanatical tendencies, you should first worry about
the ones who take their fanaticism to the extreme of killing people. Or
the extreme of advocating holy war.
Do I disagree with Christians fixated on what other people believe, who
think how much better off the world would be if they read the Bible? Yes, I
also disagree with people who rant and rave about how much better off the
world would be if people read Marx more often. Although they don't like to
admit it, those who insist "you need to actually READ Marx!!!" often sound
just as fanatical as the Christians. Let people be. Let them chose their own
course in life. People must have the chance to fail greatly in order to have
the chance to succeed greatly. Keep your bible and your Marx to yourself. If
I become interested on my own accord, I'll join in. That's freedom of
thought. Don't insult people for being poor. Or rich. And remember brains
can be just as abusive as muscle. And as far as intellectual patterns
dominating society, who decides which patterns are more moral? People have
done some dumb things for the Christian church, sure. Giving up all their
possessions and money by donating it to the church. Well, governments can do
that to people too. "Moral economic
theories" can do exactly the same thing, by persuading people to "donate"
all their personal savings to the community. After all, isn't it more
moral for society to have a joint savings account? We can vote on who gets
to divvy out the most money to whom. See the problems? People can and WILL
pervert "moral" economic theories just as people pervert aspects of their
religion. Only maximization of private freedoms can keep such dangers at a
safe distance. If you want to live in a bubble, fine. Box yourself away, and
you should damn well have that right. You wanna volunteer at the Red Cross
or the student socialist club, go for it. The point is, we already have the
right to do that. That's worth being thankful for.
People are just GOING to get fixated on certain things from time to time.
Singling out the church as a source doesn't have much value to me. People
who are fixated on winning America Idol can be just as mean and
unrealistic as a bible-thumper. And why not attack professional sports if
you're really serious about attacking static, unintellectual patterns
which people get fanatic about? Football fans can way crazier than people
in church. Whether or not a given team wins a given game is something
people CARE about and it's all a game. Why not bash people who watch
sports? Are they not brainwashed fanatics? Are the athletes themselves not
powerful? Do they not hold, in some instances, as much power as Pat
Robertson? Is it okay to idolize someone who throws balls but not okay to
idolize someone who died on a cross? Don't they both talk with hatred of
the opposing teams, but that's all it is. Trash talk. "Screw that team!
May their fans go to hell." My friends, that can NOT be truthfully compared
to ideologies that involve actual KILLING. Yes, some christians are brain
dead zombies. So are some sports fans. So are some Marxists. Better to have
a society of brain dead dolts watching TV and drinking beer than going out
and killing in the name of some murderous ideology! Think, people! Indeed.
And next time you want to bash patriotism, think about bashing team spirit
too. JON
MOQ.ORG - http://www.moq.org
Mail Archives:
Aug '98 - Oct '02 - http://alt.venus.co.uk/hypermail/moq_discuss/
Nov '02 Onward - http://www.venus.co.uk/hypermail/moq_discuss/summary.html
MD Queries - horse@darkstar.uk.net
To unsubscribe from moq_discuss follow the instructions at:
http://www.moq.org/md/subscribe.html
This archive was generated by hypermail 2.1.5 : Wed Apr 27 2005 - 21:14:05 BST