From: Platt Holden (pholden@sc.rr.com)
Date: Thu Nov 24 2005 - 14:55:22 GMT
Hi David H.
Platt previously:
> > Everyone seems to agree with the sliding scale metaphor, but on second
> > thought I would change "awful" to "evil" to better reflect the moral
> > content of Pirsig's meaning of "value."
David H:
> If you change it to evil then I would disagree. As we know, a doctor
> killing a germ is moral; intellect triumphs over biology. A germ killing a
> patient is evil; biology over intellect. But this is across levels. On
> the one level you can have differing levels of doctors and differing levels
> of germs who by themselves run a scale from good to awful (not evil).
OK, point well taken. But, it's the constant conflict between levels that
grabbed most of Pirsig's attention while constructing his MOQ. Thus, my
emphasis on "evil."
David H:
> In my view 'value judgement' is an expression of value. To me, this can
> happen at any of the levels. For clarity let's look at the dictionary
> definition.
>
> Definition: The act or process of judging; the formation of an opinion
> after consideration or deliberation.
>
> This would clearly indicate an intellectual component. I'm wrong, value
> judgements are ideas.
Your argument is the same as Paul's. I buy it, but with reservation. I
tend toward the notion that direct experience and value judgment (sans
thinking) occur simultaneously.
Platt previously
> > Yes, but ideas can also be static social patterns when the ideas are
> > embedded in groupthink.
David H.
> I think if this were the case then they are cultural patterns and not
> social patterns per say.
To me there's no difference between social and cultural patterns.
> > Interesting phrase -- those who "blend with Dynamic Quality." How does
> > one attain such a desirable state?
> Refer my last post to your good self in the "MD Looking for the primary
> difference" thread.
Got it. On that score we think alike.
Regards,
Platt
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