From: Platt Holden (pholden@sc.rr.com)
Date: Sun Apr 20 2003 - 16:09:04 BST
Dear Wim:
> You wrote 17 Apr 2003 11:21:07 -0400:
> 'I don't agree with [Kuitert's] definition of postmodernism as the movement
> that rid the Western world of heresy. Instead, that was the great
> contribution of the Enlightenment.'
>
> I don't read such a definition in his words. He described 'postmodern
> culture' as 'the stage of not charging others with heresy anymore'.
> The Enlightenment indeed enabled people to substitute the distinction
> between true and false ideas for the distinction between orthodox and
> heretic ideas. It claimed that rational thinking and/or empirical methods
> would enable one to make this distinction. As most people most of the time
> are NOT thinking rationally and are using rules of thumb indirectly and
> often mistakenly derived from experience rather than empirical methods, the
> 'modern culture' resulting from Enlightenment is the stage of people
> charging others of entertaining false ideas, of people judging one another
> by their ideas. The Dutch word 'verketteren' which I translated (probably
> too literally) as 'charge with heresy' is commonly used in a broader, more
> metaphorical sense then the way you interpreted it. It rather means
> 'denunciate', like we often do on this list (-;
IMO, to disagree with someone is not the same as charging them with
heresy. Personal (ad hominem) attacks can amount to denunciation,
but a vigorously defending one's opinion and judging another's ideas as
being low quality isn't necessarily bad.
> Don't you think that 'postmodern culture' (to be distinguished from your
> 'postmodern movement'), understood as a step beyond 'modern culture' in the
> sense that people do not denunciate each other any more for their ideas, is
> a step forward? 'Postmodern culture' as Kuitert (I think) means it, is
> simply a culture with freedom of speech.
Well, freedom of speech to me means that a government will not
interfere in the expressions of its citizens nor punish those who
disagree with the government's policies. I'm all in favor of that. But, I'm
not in favor of a society that would prevent me denouncing a politician
who espouses Nazism or Marxism.
> But ... if everyone can express any opinion and if during centuries of
> 'modern culture' neither rationality nor empiricism apparently produced
> much consensus, how can we know what ideas are more valuable than others?
> Rational thinking and empirical testing have been proven incredible as
> means to choose between ways of giving our lives Meaning, both individually
> and collectively. That's why we need a step even beyond 'postmodern
> culture' and just freedom to each follow our own lights.
Agree. "Freedom to each to follow his own lights" is also my clarion
call. That's why I'm a libertarian. But "freedom" does not mean freedom
from criticism.
> To return to the start of this thread: simply invoking 'God', as a
> reference to old myths or to a personlike being who will choose for us and
> relieve us from suffering, is no solution. I don't think that man's command
> of 'the Word' is a solution either. Everyone simply creates his own world
> of words (his own 'final vocabulary'?). That won't prevent us from falling
> in the old habit of pitting our words against those of others, charging
> them of 'heresy' or 'falsehood' or whatever. ('Man is for a while a
> governor of spirit, because he commands the word, and the power of the word
> is spirit.' was not my statement, but Kuitert's.) Man's command of Beauty
> and Meaning may be the solution. Beauty and Meaning can indeed be said to
> reflect the 'spirit' or 'god'. And if we experience Beauty and Meaning in
> direct, personal, intimate relationship, we can also write 'Spirit' or
> 'God'.
Yes, yes. If everyone took responsibility for making life beautiful for
himself and others, what a wonderful world this would be. Making life
beautiful is nothing less than pursuing Quality. Often, the best way to
make life beautiful is to stop trying to exercise control over others and
circumstances let DQ do it's thing, as expressed in "Let go, let God."
One of my favorite bits of advice (whose source I've forgotten) is:
"Remaining detached and watching developments requires no energy,
no cost, and a possible beneficial outcome."
But, this doesn't mean we can't express our views vigorously. After all,
wouldn't you agree that this Forum is sometimes a meaningful and
beautiful thing?
Platt
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