From: Wim Nusselder (wim.nusselder@antenna.nl)
Date: Wed Jun 11 2003 - 22:25:46 BST
Dear Sam,
You asked 23 Apr 2003 15:12:39 +0100:
'Are you comfortable with the idea that DQ is relative to the position of
the person experiencing? ie that what is SQ to one might be DQ to another?'
What is a static pattern of value to one cannot be DQ (the value of change
to the better) to another. The DQ I experience may differ from the DQ you
experience, i.e. the (for me) new static pattern of value that's left in the
wake of my DQ experience may be an old static pattern of value for or vice
versa. Whether a specific static pattern of value that appears in one's
experience (e.g. democracy) constitutes progress or degeneration compared to
previous experience, depends on the evolutionary level of this previous
experience. If this previous experience contains sociocracy, democracy
constitutes degeneration; if it contains autocracy, democracy constitutes
progress.
So yes, DQ is relative to the static patterns of value you participate in.
You also wrote 23 Apr:
'I would say that mythology is level 3 thinking; level 4 thinking operates
on the basis of the relevant level 3 foundations.'
in reply to my:
'Locating mythological thinking in the 4th level, but evolutionary preceding
rational thinking, myths for me almost by definition refer to low-quality
intellectual patterns of value.'
This is not only a matter of different definitions (my definition of the 3rd
level ruling out 'thinking' at that level). It is also a matter of different
valuation of mythology.
We agree that mythological thinking is of lower quality than rational
thinking, but for you rational thinking needs mythology as its basis. For me
it doesn't.
I agree that rational thinking needs presuppositions, but I disagree that
the relation between 3rd and 4th level is a relationship between
presuppositions and conclusions. These presuppositions can be taken either
from pre-rational sources or from post-rational sources, but in any case
they are just as much part of the 4th level as the rational conclusions
derived.
With friendly greetings,
Wim
MOQ.ORG - http://www.moq.org
Mail Archives:
Aug '98 - Oct '02 - http://alt.venus.co.uk/hypermail/moq_discuss/
Nov '02 Onward - http://www.venus.co.uk/hypermail/moq_discuss/summary.html
MD Queries -
To unsubscribe from moq_discuss follow the instructions at:
http://www.moq.org/md/subscribe.html
This archive was generated by hypermail 2.1.5 : Wed Jun 11 2003 - 22:37:24 BST