From: Joe (jhmau@sbcglobal.net)
Date: Mon Aug 04 2003 - 22:24:51 BST
On 1 August 2003 1:56AM Bo writes:
Bo:
Materialist?! As if THAT is any threat to the Q-idea? The idealist view that
Pirsig himself brings is doubly harmful. He does not say "in our mind", but
"human specific" spells the same. Maybe I lose you here Johnny, but it all
relates to the definition of intellectual level as "mind/thinking" and that
the MOQ is an intellectual pattern, i.e: "in our minds" ....and why I so
vehemently opposes that definition and maintains that intellect is the S/O
divide itself!
Hi Bo, Johnny and all,
joe: when I consider the S in "S/O divide" it seems the S is also divided.
I can see male/female/mother/father/O. I asked my wife if there was any
reality in the "Men from Mars and Women from Venus", formulation and she
answered, Of Course! I am reminded of Wim's reluctance to consider much
progress until more women participate. I am also reminded of
Erin/Markeena's startling post which emphasized that the intellect is fine,
but women have a necessary experience of the organic in childbirth.
I want to say that a balance between the orders is more important than a
hierarchy for moral purposes. From a perspective of balance, one order is
not more important than another. All are equally important. I draw an
analogy to missing body parts. everything works together.
In order to logically present a way of knowing things by an instinctive
sense of reality, intuition, I assume two characteristics which seem to
indicate an interaction between separate co-existing universes. The first
characteristic is 'emanation'. The connection between my brains and
undefined dq is an 'emanation' from dq. Gravitation, radiation, weak
nuclear, strong nuclear forces are static. They act upon patterns instead
of the undefined, in the way we know them. 'Emanation', 'abstraction', what
is the difference? IMO To 'emanate' is a continuing process, capable of one
to many. To 'abstract' is a one on one process.
The second characteristic is the creation of an awareness field by DNA.
From earlier posts about my experience of the 'now' and what is around me,
it seems that I have "threshold"! I am not overwhelmed by everything in my
awareness at once. I can pick and choose what I let in. My brains which
receive 'emanations' from dq seem to have separate connections to my
awareness. They may have their own threshold control, it is pretty obsure
talking about the undefined.
My awareness seems to be unstructured. As a baby my capacity was limited.
I did not become what I experienced, but I did practice and learn, and in
some way create my individuality. Education is necesary. I learn words, I
create my threshold control. I have an instinctive sense of my limitations.
My experience is individual, and I create my own meaning for some words.
When communicating from my own individuality, I can only communicate if
others trust me.
And now the moral orders inorganic, organic, social, intellectual grab my
attention. As an organic I have a further development than the inorganic.
By sensation I know what I need to have to survive. I must be allowed to
pursue my organic purpose. (Freedom)
As a social being I love another. Knowing order, I have an emotional
contact with my environment. (The good of the many outweighs the good of
the one.)
As an intellectual being I create myself. I have comprehension and
apprehension. I put things together. I am trained and educated. (The good
of the one outweighs the good of the many) As I read the bible it seems
that "Render to Caesar what is Caesar's, and to God what is God's", and the
further addition in other scriptures,"and to me what is mine." translates
organic to social to intellectual order in revelation.
How all of this becomes a moral order is unclear. My conscience can be my
emotional apprehension of existence. Value is not static, and sometimes the
most moral thing I can do is to run like hell!
Joe
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