From: Valuemetaphysics@aol.com
Date: Thu Nov 20 2003 - 15:36:32 GMT
Mark you wrote:
Mark 19-11-03: For your benefit: We must make a distinction between: 1.
Art
(Dynamic). 2. The (static) products of Art. Thus, Intellect in motion is
a
Dynamic artistic activity, while the static repertoire from which new
art is
created is the sum total of all previous Dynamic intellectual activity.
Truth is part of the static repertoire, and it is an Artistic creation,
like
subjects and objects.
Mark
The other night I was watching "Lawrence of Arabia" one of my favorite
films. I was reminded by the scene with the train of Pirsig's own talk
about the cutting edge of reality being the cutting edge of the train.
That cutting edge of reality has been on my mind lately. I agree that
art products may become static, but that is not Art itself.
Mark 20-11-03: We agree on that!
The cutting edge of reality is changing and dynamic in nature. Art, truth,
morality
and quality exist on that cutting edge.
Mark 20-11-03: Truth is always static. They change, even Euclidean geometry
is not truthful in all circumstances.
By the time we get to it intellectually, the train has gone on by, unless we
take life as
existing on the cutting edge of reality. Unfortunately I don't believe
we, as humans, have the capacity to do that for very long if at all.
Mark 20-11-03: It's not easy to maintain the cutting edge, but Native
American Indians do rather well, and flashes of insight produce evolve static
patterns.
Intellect also can't survive on that edge, it's a static pattern.
Mark 20-11-03: Intellect does not sit idle and still, it moves and creates.
When it creates it is responding to DQ, and when it does not it is composed of
a static repertoire of patterns. I tried to spell this out in 'The edge of
chaos' because i think it's what Pirsig says when you examine Lila.
However the value might be that we can intellectually support the values
that can help us recognize that edge. I was thinking about the process
of art, often I believe it is the artist interpretation of that edge
that is communicated through their work. I remember being in an art
museum in Europe once and there was a small exhibit of just blank
canvasses from various well known artist. At first I though, "Yeah
right, who is kidding us here, this isn't art." Now I understand that
they were all experiencing the same value of the same cutting edge. That
moment right before the process begins of creating. Pirsig wasn't really
that clear on the subject other than writing, "Finally there's a fourth
Dynamic morality which isn't a code. I suppose you could call it "Code
of Art" or something like that, but art is usually though of as such a
frill that the title undercuts its importance." I still am not sure what
the "Code of Art" exactly is but perhaps it is all related to that edge.
Just a thought.
Mati
Hi Mati,
The code of art Pirsig refers to is largely Eastern in flavour and too
confined and restricted by Western notions of Art. That may be why he did not wish
to use it in Lila as your quote indicates, because the Western conception of
art is static. The Eastern conception is living; the Cook and his knife - the
Tao - Quality.
I only really got onto this myself in recent years so please be patient -
when the 'penny drops' you are going to be in for a very pleasant and satisfying
Aaaaaaahhh! moment. :-) You may like to take a peak at Northrop's 'The meeting
of East and West' - a long book, but an easy read with a few eye openers
along the way. And read, 'The master butcher' at the beginning of 'The edge of
chaos' on the MoQ.org?
In the West, intellect has for its creations the SoM mythos and truth. In the
East, the mythos is more artistic and closer to Quality i feel. Now we all
have the MoQ, which places Dynamic Quality as the source of everything, and
static products as works of Art.
I think Pirsig was clear upon this, but he was ostensible in his approach -
he indicated through example - we all read ZMM and Lila, and if that wasn't an
artistic experience then what was? ;-)
All the best,
Mark
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