RE: MD SOLAQI as a gift of understanding

From: Paul Turner (paulj.turner@ntlworld.com)
Date: Wed Jan 28 2004 - 10:58:25 GMT

  • Next message: Mati Palm-Leis: "RE: MD SOLAQI as a gift of understanding"

    David

    Paul:
    In the MOQ, mind and consciousness are just one level of patterns
    created by value.
     
    DM said:
    Disagree, how do you step out of consciousness or make consciousness an
    object, consciousness is inevitably tied up with all experience/quality/
    even so-called objects in the sense that you cannot really separate
    subjects and objects -i.e. they always go together.

    Paul:
    I had this discussion with Scott. By saying that "consciousness is
    inevitably tied up with all experience" you seem to be equating
    consciousness with Quality. If this is the starting point then it
    follows that everything is consciousness. If you limit the definition of
    consciousness to the intellectual level then value is "outside of"
    consciousness as it is the *source* of consciousness.

    A problem with equating Quality with consciousness is that it tends to
    lead to an idealist metaphysics and then onto an "absolute mind" or
    "divine reason" or "mind of God." This becomes difficult/impossible to
    pin down empirically the way Pirsig does with value and we are back to
    faith.

    Regards

    Paul

    MOQ.ORG - http://www.moq.org
    Mail Archives:
    Aug '98 - Oct '02 - http://alt.venus.co.uk/hypermail/moq_discuss/
    Nov '02 Onward - http://www.venus.co.uk/hypermail/moq_discuss/summary.html
    MD Queries - horse@darkstar.uk.net

    To unsubscribe from moq_discuss follow the instructions at:
    http://www.moq.org/md/subscribe.html

    This archive was generated by hypermail 2.1.5 : Wed Jan 28 2004 - 10:58:23 GMT