From: Platt Holden (pholden@sc.rr.com)
Date: Wed Feb 11 2004 - 12:56:29 GMT
Hi Poot,
> What was said:
>
> --:If Mozart were alive today, what kind of music do you think he'd be
> making? I doubt he'd be composing in the classical style.
>
> -Platt: Disagree. Great art transcends societies.
>
> -=*POOT*=- Your answer seems muddled Platt. You seem to be saying that if
> Mozart were alive today, he would be composing his musics, in the manner in
> which he composed them hundreds of years in the past. If he lived today,
> how could he possibly write in that style? This is why no one writes like
> mozart today.
No one is writing classical music today? Check out:
http://dir.yahoo.com/Entertainment/Music/Artists/By_Genre/Classical/Compose
rs/20th_Century_and_Contemporary/
> Todays world is not the same as his, and thus his music,
> which is a reflection upon his world, would not be the same.
Great music is a reflection of Spirt, not world. Refer to your last
paragraph below.
> He would not
> be trying to express the same emotions that were dominant in his life then,
> because his life would be totally different now(and this is all assuming he
> would even choose to write music!).
What emotions are you talking about? Have feelings of love and hate
changed in the past 300 years?
> Platt: Madonna's influence was sexual and thus anti-social.
>
>
> -=*POOT*=- Could you explain to me how sex is anti-social? It is the
> _attitude_ in which people regard sex which is social or anti-social.
Sex and violenece are biological level values that society must control.
From Pirsig: "Things like sex and booze and drugs and- tobacco have a high
biological quality, that is, they feel good, but are harmful for social
reasons. They take all your money. They break up your family. They
threaten the stability of the community." (Lila, Chp 13).
> Platt: There has never been, nor possibly ever be, a more profound
> depiction of animals than on the caves of Lascaux.
>
> -=*POOT*=- Saying something like this, is just ridiculously subjective.
Many art authorities agree, so it's not ridiculous at all. Collective
judgments of experts brings purely subjective opinions closer to
objectivity.
> Platt: Disagree. Beauty transcends contexts. Art critic Clement Greenberg
> had it right when he wrote: "Esthetic enjoyments are immediate, intuitive,
> undeliberate and involuntary and leave no room for conscious application of
> standards, criteria, rules or precepts."
>
>
> -=*POOT*=- Perhaps esthetic enjoyments are immediate and intuitive, etc,
> etc. How ever, you are not taking into account that modern art has
> changed form drastically from previous eras. Now, we are not just
> listening to(for) musical excellence, but also lyrical excellence. Lyrical
> excellence is attained sometimes through a deliberate an act as placing a
> note or phrase on a piece of paper. They directly address the artists
> concerns. They are less open to misinterpretation, since they address
> things more directly.
What are you talking about? Please give examples. Are you talking about
Snoop Doggy Dog?.
> Platt: Finally, to suggest that Radiohead or any other rock band is
> creatively on
> a par with Beethoven or Mozart is to me ludicrous, like comparing jelly
> glasses to fine crystal stemware. Even a child can see the difference.
>
>
> -=*POOT*=- Well, as you said, it is to _you_ ludicrous. Is it like
> comparing jelly to crystal? Can you compare Beethoven with Bach or Mozart.
> To put it bluntly, "HELL NO!" They are, each in their own right, artists,
> free from subjective discrimination. ANyways, have you listened to
> Radiohead? Obviously not. Many of their songs have complex harmonies and
> rhythms, that Bach, Beethoven, and Mozart didnt even write!! Does this
> mean that they're better, of course not.
Beethoven, Bach, Mozart are light years superior to rock bands.
> Perhaps you may all dismiss my opinion, but _I_ have studied music for the
> greater part of my life. I have played Beethoven, Mozart, Bach, Liszt,
> Schumann, Bartok, and countless others. I have experienced a connection
> with the composers not achievable simply by listening to music. When I
> played Beethovens 'Pastoral' sonata, after really learning the piece over
> a few months, the feeling of playing the music is undescribable. So, after
> saying that, I hope you value my opinion more.
Yes-you've got it. Indescribable is where it's at. I get the same feeling
playing Beethoven's "Moonlight" sonata.
Platt
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