Re: MD Quality takes a hit

From: steve (arborealman@comcast.net)
Date: Tue Mar 09 2004 - 18:47:29 GMT

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    To Leland; I sit corrected, I think. You obviosly--know a lot more about
    computers than I do. However, what I meant was that any company is free to
    produce a superior o.s. and priced lower it would replace windows by the
    force of the market.If this is not so please explain why if You think I
    will understand it. Further, dont many companys have their trade secrets?
    As a resident of boston I know at least one person went to jail for selling
    proprietary technolegy concerning Gilletts razor blade construction. And
    just try to get recipe out of a chef We stray from our subject. Thanks
    Steveq_discuss@moq.org>
    Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2004 11:58 AM
    Subject: Re: MD Quality takes a hit

    > On Mar 9, 2004, at 8:46, Platt Holden wrote:
    >
    > >> Martha was a thief who
    > >> illegally received and acted on insider information to enrich herself
    > >> and
    > >> then lied about it at every turn.
    > >
    > > How did Martha "enrich herself?" Preserving the value of you assets is
    > > hardly "enrichment."
    >
    > So using fixed dice in Vegas (assuming you could ever get away with it)
    > would be a moral exercise? The stock market is a gamble, Martha knows
    > that (she was a stock broker, for Pete's sake!). Martha also knows
    > people lose money playing the stocks. However, she used a privileged
    > piece of information to ensure that she didn't lose on her gamble. She
    > abused the system, she cheated. Use whatever term you like, but she was
    > in the wrong.
    >
    > And then, to top it all off, she lied about cheating. I'd have more
    > respect for her if she'd been caught with her hand in the cookie jar
    > and said "It's a fair cop." We are all responsible for our actions
    > (whether "right" or "wrong"), and we have to face consequences when our
    > actions take us outside of the social framework of law. If the law is
    > just, then the punishment will be. If the law is unjust, then it will
    > be changed in the process and our actions will be vindicated.
    >
    > >> She lied under oath, forged documents,
    > >> and even got others to lie and forge on her behalf.
    > >
    > > An apt description of Clinton's behavior during the Lewinsky affair.
    > > Yet
    > > do you see him behind bars? Hardly equal, even-handed justice in my
    > > book.
    >
    > Sure, what Clinton did was immoral as far as his relationship with his
    > wife went and illegal as far as the marriage was concerned, but it was
    > a private matter and had little to do with how he ran the country.
    > Martha stole money from investors and endangered the very corporation
    > that she founded, which employs thousands of people. Which immoral
    > action do you think affected more people?
    >
    > > The real thief in this story is the Federal Drug Administration which
    > > disapproved of ImClone's application for a new anti-cancer drug, and
    > > application which they later approved! Your friendly government robbed
    > > ImClone investors, not Martha.
    >
    > The FDA is well within its rights to approve or deny any application it
    > likes. I'm not familiar with the 'ins and outs' of the ImClone
    > application, I don't know if there were any amendments to it between
    > the initial denial and the subsequent approval. Martha, however, is not
    > within her rights to use insider information to profit herself on the
    > stock market. The FDA acted legally (as far as I know), whereas Martha
    > acted illegally.
    >
    > >> Regardless of the alleged quality of her products or efforts on
    > >> behalf of "average shlubs", her refusal to plea to the crime she
    > >> actually
    > >> committed and decision to lie and cover-up endangered the corporation
    > >> she
    > >> built and the hundreds, if not thousands, of hard-working "average
    > >> shlubs"
    > >> who depend on it for their livelihoods.
    > >
    > > All of which pales in comparison to the coarsening effect on the
    > > culture
    > > of Clinton's lying and sexual escapades. Furthermore, anyone who
    > > depends
    > > on someone else for his livelihood better grow up and get some skills
    > > that
    > > are marketable regardless of who signs their paychecks.
    >
    > OK, what do Clinton's escapades have to do with Martha's case?
    > Clinton's thing is done. It's finished. Get over it. You're comparing
    > apples and oranges here. Also, do you mean to tell me you DON'T depend
    > on someone else for your livelihood? Do you own your own company? If
    > so, do you employ anyone else? Guess what... those people depend on you
    > for their livelihood. Pull your head out and take a look around you.
    > Contrary to what your comments imply, jobs DON'T grow on trees.
    >
    > > "The strongest moral argument against capital punishment is that it
    > > weakens a society's Dynamic capability-its capability for change and
    > > evolution. It's not the "nice" guys who bring about real social change.
    > > "Nice" guys look nice because they're conforming. It's the "bad" guys,
    > > who
    > > only look nice a hundred years later, that are the real Dynamic force
    > > in
    > > social evolution."
    >
    > I hardly think Pirsig is condoning wanton ignorance of the law. To be
    > honest, I see this as one of the more ambiguous paragraphs in the book.
    >
    > I'm all for improving the legal system, and DQ is the only thing that
    > can do it. What Martha did was not DQ (and it is insulting to DQ to
    > suggest that it was). I get the point, you like Martha and are outraged
    > that she's been convicted. However, the charges aren't trumped-up. She
    > broke the frelling law and now she has to face the consequences. Deal
    > with it.
    >
    > BTW, as far as Bill Clinton is concerned he ALSO broke the law (or at
    > least one of society's stronger social moral codes) and he, too, ended
    > up facing the consequences, in the form of massive public
    > embarrassment. He's fortunate that he couldn't have run for office
    > again, since it is certain he would have lost (and by a greater margin
    > than Gore lost) because of his actions. Maybe that's why conservatives
    > are so pissed at him, he never had anything taken away from him (read,
    > the presidency). To some, it looks like he got away with it.
    >
    > --
    > Leland Jory :^{)>
    > Cafeteria Spiritualist and Philosopher
    >
    > "It is a puzzling thing. The truth knocks on the door and you say, 'Go
    > away, I'm looking for the truth.' and so it goes away. Puzzling." -
    > Robert Pirsig, Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance
    >
    >
    >
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