From: johnny moral (johnnymoral@hotmail.com)
Date: Tue Jun 01 2004 - 17:02:29 BST
Oops, I forgot to change the subject back to the thread I was responding to:
Patterns.
Does anyone care to comment on the time component of patterns, how they
ontologically continue the past into the future? Also, patterns explain
what consciousness is - it is patterns. Patterns are all that
consciousness is conscious of, and patterns could not exist without
consciousness to see them into the future.
>From: "johnny moral" <johnnymoral@hotmail.com>
>Reply-To: moq_discuss@moq.org
>To: moq_discuss@moq.org
>Subject: Re: MD MOQ and The Moral Evolution of Society.
>Date: Fri, 28 May 2004 20:27:11 +0000
>
>Hi gang,
>
>How is everyone doing?
>
>I let my hotmail account expire when I let a month go by without accessing
>it, and I guess that got me unsubscribed, so I've just been taking a break
>from posting (and giving you a break from me posting:-)). But I've been
>peeking at the archives periodically to see what's been going on, and I
>just couldn't let this remarkable development go by without comment, so I
>resubscribed:
>
>Platt wrote on May 7th:
>>I agree with you and DMB that change in and of itself doesn't always mean
>that DQ is involved, a point I've repeated several times in other posts.
>So when you say, "When Pirsig uses the phrase 'static pattern' I don't
>think that he means to exclude change or to associate change with Dynamic
>Quality," I say, "Right on."
>
>I remember you and others pretty much dismissed me when I was making this
>point last year, you all said that static patterns never change, by
>definition. So I'm glad to see you've expanded your rigid definition of
>static patterns. Static patterns change when they are influenced by other
>static patterns. In fact, static patterns are always changing, quite
>obvioulsy in the case of individuals (witness Platt's coming around on this
>topic but still being Platt) and less obviously in the case of a glass of
>water (it loses atoms very slowly). Even patterns like Gravity must slowly
>change, I would think.
>
>An important aspect to a pattern no one mentioned is the element of time
>passing in the repeating of a pattern. A pattern represents the past
>becoming the present, according to the pattern. It is formed from
>experience and is expected to continue into the future. The pattern of a
>glass is an expectation, based on the pattern, that it will remain a glass,
>and that carries it into the future. If the glass falls and breaks
>(because the pattern of glasses breaking when they hit the floor is
>stronger), then the pattern is gone. The stronger an expectation, the
>stronger the pattern, and the greater value it has. Value comes from
>expectation being realized, from patterns continuing. The patterns of
>things that no longer exist, like the Holy Roman Empire, do not exist any
>more, only the pattern of it as a historical concept exists now, and only
>the historical concept continues to exist into the future to create the
>present.
>
>So, that's what I say a pattern is. I agree with Pirsig that they are
>"integral and inherent in reality".
>
>Have any of you given any more thought to how Expectation neatly expresses
>morality, value, and quality? Or have you been relieved not to have to
>hear about it? I've been reading Neitzsche and Heidegger, and I think
>Neitzsche's Will To Power is a way of expressing the ontology of
>expectation: expectation is what will be, and values it being so, as that
>empowers expectation itself.
>
>Johnny
>
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