Re: MD the metaphysics of free-enterprise

From: Mark Steven Heyman (markheyman@infoproconsulting.com)
Date: Sat Jul 10 2004 - 05:21:48 BST

  • Next message: ml: "Re: MD the metaphysics of free-enterprise"

    On 8 Jul 2004 at 11:38, ml wrote:
    > msh:
    > He might feel as you do. However, with Microsoft, as with any
    major
    > corporation, it's easy to demonstrate that their "success" derives
    > directly from, shall we say, "borrowed" technology, publicly
    > subsidized R&D, publicly subsidized advertising via tax breaks and
    > higher consumer prices, followed by technically illegal
    monopolistic
    > business practices, conveniently ignored by government for many
    many
    > years, until a "token" prosecution occurs long after the horse is
    > galloping down the street. The end result is a huge disparity
    > between worker's wages, management salaries, and owner's profit.
    >

    mel:
    I am not sure Microsoft's history shows that...
    Most of Microslop's success comes from the understanding that
    marketing wins in a contest with technical excellence. They made the
    point of their business to provide a needed product to the hardware
    people in the form of an easier to use system which MS would support
    and the headache of that support would not devolve to the Computer
    maker. Win-win-win...the majority of customers can use the shaky
    patches system of windows to do what they need to do. The hardware
    company has no need to invest in support and MS gets paid.

    msh says:
    Hi Mel. Not sure where you get your Microsoft history, but it sounds
    like it's from their publicity press releases. I'll be happy to give
    you a crash-course, starting with the fact that Bill Gates and Paul
    Allen were first known as Trafo-Data, or something, in the mid 70's.
    Lemme know if you're interested.

    > msh says:
    > The implication, shared by almost all business owners, is that
    > employees aren't capable of running a business; if they were, they
    > would be owners themselves. My suggestion is that there are other
    > reasons why someone might choose to rent themselves for wages,
    > rather than run their own business.

    SO TRUE!
    I had a business through the 90's with 29 people working. As
    with most small business owners, I wanted the best people
    and easily 2/3 of them could have run the business as well
    or better than I, but they were enough smarter than I that they
    could see how much work was involved.

    msh says:
    Or, maybe, some of them preferred making a living without exploiting
    others, even if it meant being exploited themselves. And, since you
    seem to be confused by the word, I'm using "exploited" in the
    economic sense of paying an employee less than the value of his
    product, so that the product may be sold for a profit.

    >
    > >msh says:
    > >A dictator has no country, just as a business owner has no
    > >business, without the exploitation of people and resources. This,
    I
    > >think, is the thrust of Pirsig's analogy.

    mel:
    Possible equivocation in this statement.

    msh:
    See above. "Exploitation" in the economic sense, is pretty well
    understood.

    > However, my position would be that, in the western hemisphere,
    there
    > is a direct connection between the wealth of the north, and the
    > poverty of the south, in fact a deliberate and inverse
    relationship.
    > I've discussed this relationship elsewhere on the list, and won't
    go
    > into it here, unless someone wants to pursue the issue.
    >
     
    mel:
    I think history and economics shows this assertion not to be true.
    Economies South of the Rio Grande are traditionally paternalistic
    systems run by a small group of elite in each country. Only at the
    village and produce market level are they dynamic and free. If you
    are looking at real money you must make deals with the "right"
    families. That was a Spanish creation, but the families are also the
    ones who traditionally 'pick' their country's rulers.

    msh says:
    I find it difficult to believe that you belive this. And don't know
    what to say, after that. I can recommend some books on American
    interventions in Latin America, I suppose.

    Best,
    Mark Steven Heyman (msh)

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