In a message dated 4/12/02 5:47:43 PM GMT Daylight Time, pholden@sc.rr.com
writes:
<< Subj: Re: MD ignorance and the rule of emotion
Date: 4/12/02 5:47:43 PM GMT Daylight Time
From: pholden@sc.rr.com (Platt Holden)
Sender: owner-moq_discuss@venus.co.uk
Reply-to: moq_discuss@moq.org
To: moq_discuss@moq.org
Hi Everyone:
It is clear in the MOQ that capitalism (free markets) and democratic
representative governments are better (higher quality) than
communism, socialism, Nazism and all forms of totalitarianism such
as found in Arab nations. Nothing in the MOQ claims capitalism and
democracy are perfect. But Pirsig makes clear they are superior
because they allow for (in fact, encourage) greater influence of
Dynamic Quality-the creative evolutionary force.
Hi Platt,
Trading is a social activity.
There is a difference between what people need and what they want.
In capitalist societies peoples are coerced into feeling they want that which
they do not need.
Therefore capitalist social structures are founded upon waste.
Much of that which a consumerists society generates is of low value and a
dissipation of planetary resources.
That is the free market for you; freedom to trash the planet with increasing
vigour and resolution that what one is doing is moral.
An intellectual stance recognises that society can become out of control and
is not inherently free in the sense capitalists feel it is or should be.
A trading, (no pun intended) of freedom for long term planetary health is a
sacrifice i feel the MOQ would support?
Socialist structures are rather like Christianity; great idea but people are
not that benevolent.
In a modified form, socialism is exactly what the MOQ would advocate; society
ruled by intellect for the benefit of all humanity.
So it comes as a surprise to see that some who come to this site
attempt to invoke the MOQ to support anti-capitalist and anti-
democratic views, especially when referring to the Israel-Palestine
conflict.
What you appear to be surprised by are those who think for themselves and do
not feel it is necessary or appropriate to quote a static text which embodies
dynamic value.
It's also surprising to see anti-Jewish feelings being
expressed, especially in light of the persecution these people have
suffered for thousands of years not to mention the Holocaust of barely
60 years ago.
The prefix anti is dualistic, divisive, and a bit SOM in my view.
The world is not contrasted starkly but reveals delicate shading and subtle
touches.
That Jews stick together as a group is no more immoral
than the social cohesion of groups throughout the world, a cohesion
vital to any society's very survival against biological forces such as
homicide bombers.
Soldiers may expect to die for their social order.
Suicide bombers know they are going to die for their social order.
To make such a total contribution towards that which one feels to be of
higher value than one's own identity is a brave act - when given freely.
I do not suggest that suicide bombing of intellectual patterns is necessarily
moral, but then one could argue about the morality of soldiering.
Biasing the term of killer by labelling it homicidal is arbitrary and SOM.
The Jewish society's emphasis on education and
intellectualism, perhaps to a higher degree than any other group in the
world, should give pause to any critic of the Jewish people who also
finds in the MOQ an enlightened moral guide.
Fundamental jewish religion is more akin to Buddhism than a religion as such,
but rather like Catholicism, the initial text has been interpreted in a
socially reinforcing manner.
Much religious teaching is little more than a social carrot and stick job.
In my view, Jewish culture is pathologically static.
Individual Jews may be just, or more intellectually valuable as, you, i or
indeed anyone quite naturally; because intellectual patterns of value have
little relation to social values.
Quite coincidentally this week I've been reading William Shirer's "Berlin
Diary," written during the period 1934 to 1941 while the author was in
Germany witnessing the rise of Hitler and Nazism. It has many quotes
from Hitler, and as I was reading last night the following quote struck
me between the eyes:
"Jewish reactionary warmongers in the capitalistic democracies
started the war."
From Hitler's New Year's Proclamation of 1940 to the German people. I
will leave it to you, dear reader, to draw your own conclusions.
Platt
>>
Leaving 'dear readers' to draw their own conclusions was very far from
Hitler's agenda when he made inflammatory speeches.
I should hope you do not feel there are those in this forum who are in the
habit of making inflammatory speeches, or members who are incapable of
interpreting speech intellectually and without emotional bias?
All the best,
Squonk.
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