ROGER ENJOYS THE MYSTICAL DISCUSSION
Kev,
Thanks for leadin' the charge to extend the concepts. Continue to hold the
course while I play the devil's advocate.
My first challenge comes at your "proximity to DQ" argument. You wrote:
>the degree to which Dynamic Quality possesses a level
correlates to the degree which that level has become more undivided or
unified. In short, the worth of a given abstraction equals its proximity to
the undivided reality (Dynamic Quality). Once we accept this we must accept
that mysticism remains closer to Dynamic Quality than intellectualism.>
Roger:
So intellectual abstractions are closer than other abstractions? I know
Pirsig writes that intellect is more dynamic, but is this the same as what
you are saying?
Kevin:
>Yes, a mystic operates in all the lower levels too, but in addition
s/he operates inside a more Dynamic reality which lower static levels
cannot capture.>
Rog:
Otay
Kev:
>In other words, a mystic may look upon a flower
Dynamically, but a flower cannot look back as Dynamically as the mystic.
Why? Because the mystic commits her/himself to the abolition all static
levels and "flower" is a static biological value which blocks the
experience of Dynamic Quality.>
Rog:
I think we disagree on the definition of mysticism. Mystical direct
experience and Buddha nature is compared by many to a dog or a flower or the
unfiltered sensory input of a new infant. Pirsig himself mentions the quality
of comparing DQ to mystical experience. Mystical experience encompasses all
experience. It isn't a special, super, post-intellectual experience. It is
pre, post and intellectual experience.
Let me quote the Big Kahuna himself from my newly improved Teal version of
Lila.(p39). This is how he explains the mystical experience of peyote:
"perceptual modifications follow.....vivid and spontaneous
imagery......emotions are intensified.....the intellect is drawn to complex
realities or trancendental questions.......consciousness expands to include
all these responses simultaneously......disolution of personal
identity.....abandonment of the body.....the experience is determined by the
persons mental state,his personality, the physical setting, and cultural
influences."
Mysticism is not a new level it is getting more in touch with the experience
later defined as belonging to each of the levels. Mysticism is the freedom
from stale static patterns. As Our Main Man writes back a few pages(25):
"There's an old analogy to a cup of tea. If you want to drink new tea you
have to get rid of the old tea that's in your cup....Your head is like that
cup....It's very easy to spend your whole life swishing old tea around in
your cup thiunking it's great stuff because you've never really tried
anything new........"
Mysticism is one technique to freshen the tea in your cup.
Kev:
<On the other hand, mysticism cannot be considered
intellectual quality either because its whole value system opposes the
intellectual conception of reality. Mysticism is something in between,
requiring a new level.>
It opposes static stale tea at each of the levels. Mysticism is often used
to get more in touch with creative , new ideas. Mysticism is not a different
course at dinner, it is freshening your plate and cup and bowl and pipe with
fresh product......
Let me know yer thots, friend. (Others are always welcome too)
Roger
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