RE: MD Plotinus, Pirsig and Wilber

From: Paul Turner (paul@turnerbc.co.uk)
Date: Tue Aug 17 2004 - 12:19:49 BST

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    Hi Scott

    I have a feeling this dialogue will end up with you telling me that
    consciousness is too mysterious to be explained, and I kind of agree,
    but it's fun anyway.

    Scott said:
    Of course, the Plotinian has the opposite challenge of explaining how
    the intellect can materialize...

    Paul:
    As, in its system, intellect is no more the fundamental source of
    reality than matter, the MOQ avoids this challenge.

    Scott said:
    ...but I don't see any logical impossibility involved, whereas I do with
    the problem of conscious emergence. (Our perceptions are extended --
    have spatio-temporality, but if they are perceptions *of* the extended,
    passed to us by tiny signals (photons, etc.) then there is nothing
    spatio-temporal that can grasp the extended whole as a whole, since
    every event (e.g. an electron absorbing a photon, a nerve cell firing)
    is separated from every other event.

    Paul:
    Just because the inorganic and biological levels are presumed to behave
    according to intellectually constructed rules of space and time, there
    is nothing in the MOQ which forces other levels to follow those rules.
    Social patterns overcame the restrictions of physical biological
    patterns, hence, intellectual consciousness does not need to follow
    these rules. Also, intellectual patterns are created by perception of
    Quality, not photons.

    Scott said:
    It makes more sense to say that space and time are products of
    perception, that is, consciousness is what makes the material (the
    spatio-temporal) material).

    Paul:
    Agreed i.e. space and time are basic intellectual patterns that make
    great sense of inorganic and biological value.

    Regards

    Paul

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