RE: MD The empirical verifiability of value

From: Paul Turner (paul@turnerbc.co.uk)
Date: Tue Aug 31 2004 - 12:38:56 BST

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    Ham

    Ham said:
    The "leap" is not believing that Quality is "verifiably real".

    Paul:
    I agree, and that's what I said. I said that the leap is believing that
    reality is nothing but Quality.

    Ham said:
    The leap is realizing that reality is essentially "subjective" or
    immanent.

    Paul:
    I completely disagree that reality is essentially subjective.
     
    Ham said:
    If everything that is real is an "objective other", what does that say
    about our "subjective awareness" of it? That it is unreal? That it is
    an illusion of Nature? That it is excluded from participation in
    ultimate reality? The logic of that philosophy is unreasonable and
    untenable to me.

    Paul:
    Me too. I'm confused as to why you have written this. Where did I
    suggest that I supported this view?

    Ham said:
    You can deny the Source. You can apply the label Quality to it and say
    that
    Quality IS "it". (Alan Watts in his Zen-based thesis "The Supreme
    Doctrine"
    said "You are It!") But you are still bound to a metaphysics of being
    (i.e., material reality).

    Paul:
    Again, I'm confused, who has equated Quality with being or material
    reality?

    Regards

    Paul

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