From: Matthew Stone (mattstone_2000@yahoo.co.uk)
Date: Wed Jan 29 2003 - 09:26:49 GMT
Steve
I said:
> >> You ask if I read the posts. Well, have you even
> read
> >> Lila? Patterns don't value things, patterns
> manifest
> >> value, hence the term "patterns of value", not
> >> "patterns that value" - this is something of an
> >> important thing, you know
RICK said:
> > Matt, you are confusing yourself. Pirsig very
> clearly wrote that in the MoQ
> > "B values precondition A." As both "B" and "A"
> must be patterns, it should
> > be obvious even to the sloppiest reader that
> patterns themselves value
> > things (a human is a pattern Matt! Are you arguing
> humans don't value
> > things?). You're reading would completely rewrite
> Pirsig's ideas from start
> > finish.
Steve said:
> I believe the "A values
> precondition B" thing was
> used by Pirsig to show how SOM fits within the MOQ
> framework, but I don't
> think A and B are the patterns at all in this
> example. The pattern is the
> sort of relationship between A and B which is
> value-centered.
I agree, Steve. This is what I was trying to say in my
last post. The point Pirsig makes is that the pattern
is the relationship of value *between* A and B.
Saying A and B are themselves patterns just confuses
things, as the nomination of 'A' and 'B' is vaguely
SOM-orientated.
Well, I'm glad someone agrees with me!
Matt.
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