From: Mark Steven Heyman (markheyman@infoproconsulting.com)
Date: Fri Jan 14 2005 - 16:52:26 GMT
Hi all,
Here are more ideas about the relationship between powerful states
and their citizens, which might also apply to the relationships
between states themselves. In general, my argument is that it is
immoral for a state (a social institution) to curtail the freedom of
expression of ideas, even if, perhaps especially if, those ideas
challenge the legitimacy of state power. I've made a few statements
and observations along these lines, and have invited thoughtful
comment from all. I've said...
1) States are violent by their very nature, so I don't want to be
singling out the USG; they just happen to be the state with the most
violent means at their disposal.
keith said:
States are capable of compassion as well as aggression.
msh asks anyone:
Can you provide an historical example where a state acted out of
compassion, when the action meant relinquishing power?
msh continued:
2) in any state with a modicum of free expression, the means of
control must be more subtle, such as by convincing people they live
in a democracy, and that what they think really matters.
keith replied:
Well, it must be working on me. I think I live in a democracy, and I
think what I think really matters.
msh says:
I think upon investigation you will discover that your stream of
ideas are given meaningful voice only as long as they don't overflow
the banks of official opinion. Do you believe that the voices of the
millions of UK citizens who turned out against the invasion of Iraq
were given a representational voice in your news media? Compare the
coverage of the ant-war demonstrations with the repetitive and
unrelenting coverage of the government line.
Look at the evidence that's been accumulated by Herman, McChesney,
Bagdikian, Chomsky, Solomon, about the way the major media, the sort
of agenda setting media, the national press, radio and television,
operate to filter and emphasize the boundaries of acceptable
discussion. This is where is shaped and sent forth the opinions that
you hear, the kinds of information that comes through, the sources
that are given voice. I think, if you look, you will find some
pretty surprising things about your "democratic system." I highly
recommend the work being done by the Davids at MediaLens, if you'd
like some analysis of thought control in the UK.
msh quoted Ramsey Clarke:
3) "[We need] to liberate this country from corporate oligarchy;
they control our lives. This is not a democracy, it's a
plutocracy. The people don !/ t rule here, wealth rules, the
corporations rule. They rule the Congress, they elect the
President, they run the Pentagon, they own the media."
keith said:
I agree up to a point, and I think the recent trend is negative,
however, I feel that I have more chance of influencing things that I
would have even 50 years ago. The wealthy elite don't get everything
there own way, less now than ever before, don't you think?
msh says:
Look back earlier in this thread, where I offered to my friend Platt
some stats that would indicate that the gap between rich and poor is
greater than ever, and ever growing. But, yes, they, the "wealthy
elite" don't get everything their own way. The question is, why
should a small minority be permitted to benefit at the expense of the
majority, AT ALL?
keith summarized:
I find all of this TOO pessimistic. Not that these aren't in some
ways valid points, but they go too far. If all of this were true
then this discussion forum for one would have been shut down many
years ago.
msh says:
Shutting down the internet is not so easy, especially as it
contributes to profit-making; but there have been attempts to control
it. Besides, you don't need to "shut down" dissenting opinion with
boot and truncheon: In a socio-economic system controlled by wealth,
you simply buy up the bandwidth. This is what happened to radio and
tv, and this is what is happening with the web. As long as wealth
and privilege go hand in hand, the outcome is inevitable. Though it
remains for now a powerful alternative to mainstream commercial
media, the internet is rapidly becoming just another home shopping
network. Whether or not this conversion is completed is up to people
like us.
Again, thanks to all for any feedback.
Mark Steven Heyman (msh)
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