From: Mark Steven Heyman (MarkHeyman@infoproconsulting.com)
Date: Wed Apr 27 2005 - 03:55:55 BST
Hi all,
Since Ham is exhausted, I'll pick on my friend Platt for awhile...
But only on a couple of points in this very long post since Arlo
seems to be doing fine...
On 25 Apr 2005 at 18:27, Platt Holden wrote to Arlo:
Christianity never "wielded power" for 2000 years. That's what I mean by
your distortion of history.
msh says:
A slight exaggeration perhaps, but hardly a distortion. History is
distorted when the fact that millions of innocent people have been
killed by the USG in the last 150 years, much of this imperialist
mayhem carried out well before there was anything like communism to
"defend" us from, is sort of jammed down the memory hole by
apologists for US policy.
platt to arlo:
Your assumption is that all governments, whether Christian or secular, are
guilty of initiating brutality on a scale equal to modern secular
communism. That's patently false.
msh says:
No, it's demonstrably true. Turn off Bill O'Reilley and Rush
Limbaugh, and read a book, will ya? Besides, the brutality of Stalin
was no more about atheism than the US slaughter of millions in SE
Asia was about Christianity.
platt misconstrues arlo:
Oh my God. You compare Bush to Stalin, Mao, Castro, Pol Pot?
That's worse than DMB lumping Pat Robertson with Hitler. Have you no
understanding of the checks and balances that prevent any American
president from attaining unbridled power?
msh says:
This is so incredibly naïve that I, for once, am speechless. This is
a sixth grader's understanding of the American political system.
but platt drives on:
Can you not grasp the reality that in order to attain Marx's goal of eliminating economic inequalities
that a concentration of political power is necessary, providing an open
invitation to dictators?
msh says:
Again, this is about 180 degrees out of phase. A far greater
concentration of political and military power is required to keep and
expand the economic inequalities.
platt, tirelessly:
Your approval of Marx suggest support for dictatorship since his vision could
not possibly be carried out except by a totalitarian government, as the history
of the 20th century proves. .
msh says:
Saying Stalin was influenced by Marx is like saying GWB is influenced
by Jesus. If you actually had some understanding of the history of
the 20th century, you would know that there have been successful non-
totalitarian implementations of communist theory, always on a small
scale because if there is any possibility of larger success such
implementations immediately become targets of US aggression.
platt to arlo:
I find your "win for rational-secular idea of freedom" unsupported by fact.
Because men are "endowed by their Creator with liberty" puts God right at the
center of freedom. In other words, your right and mine to liberty comes from
God, not from a government permit based on some rational-secular idea,
whatever that may be.
msh says:
Am I reading this correctly? You're saying that Arlo's
interpretation is not supported by fact because God gives us freedom?
>
> [Platt]
> > Given the history of communism and its record of genocide, those who
> > aren't afraid of it don't understand it.
msh says:
Why is a brutal implementation of a pseudo--communist system
sufficient for you to detest communism? The pseudo--capitalist
system best represented by the US has its own clear record of
genocide, and, far from fearing this system, you apparently LOVE it.
I think this goes a long way toward explaining why the memory hole
is so important to you.
Well, have at it boys... I'm heading back to the sidelines..
Mark Steven Heyman (msh)
--
InfoPro Consulting - The Professional Information Processors
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Berlin, February 1, 1933
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