Re: MD Primary Reality

From: hampday@earthlink.net
Date: Thu Jun 09 2005 - 02:27:26 BST

  • Next message: Platt Holden: "Re: MD Primary Reality"

    Platt --

    First off, I don't believe we've defined the MoQ's Primary Reality, a topic
    I initiated with a "reality check" back in April in the wake of the 'Hume,
    Paley and Intelligent Design' controversy. The discussion fell into a kind
    of funk that didn't go anywhere but just seemed to float between
    subjectivism and 'immaterialism' (to use Scott's term). The ephemeral
    nature of the comments I received have convinced me that the MoQ has no
    reality and that Pirsig's much-tauted "primary empirical reality" was merely
    a metaphor to prop up his Quality concept.

    To me, statements like "Value exists because you cannot refute the belief
    without asserting a value" and "Some things are better than others" are not
    philosophical propositions but platitudes designed to evade logical
    analysis. Yet, it is just such quotations that seem to keep the MoQ alive
    (dare I add, as a cult movement?)

    You're saying now that SOM, transcendent reality, and the MoQ are all
    "allowed as high quality assumptions". Unfortunately, that's the kind of
    spongy answer I've come to expect from this group. You all seem resigned to
    the futility of metaphysics. Paul even denied that propositions could be
    either true or false, suggesting that reality is only a symbolic notion
    constructed linguistically from ideas supported by an authority-approved
    consensus. Needless to say, I'm disappointed that no one is confident
    enough of his beliefs to take a stand. Only socio-political events seem
    capable of inspiring that kind of passion.

    > But, there is no one right answer to the question, "What is real?" any
    > more than there is only one right way to think. We argue as if right and
    > wrong answers exist only because logic so demands. And because it's fun.

    But there IS a right answer to the question, Platt; we just don't have the
    capability to verify it. I get the distinct impression from this group
    that, since absolute truth is denied us, there is no primary reality, so we
    might as well play the game of Pirsig Says "because it's fun".

    My idea of a "workable" philosophy is a rationale for the human experience
    with sufficient insight and meaning to engender the personal conviction of
    the truth-seeker. However, we can't build a philosophical foundation on a
    reality that we don't believe exists. That's called Nihilism, and from what
    I've seen so far here, it pretty much describes the MoQ package.

    Anyway, thanks for the reply, Platt.

    Regards,
    Ham

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