From: Robert Warlov (Poetzzz@softhome.net)
Date: Sun Jul 24 2005 - 21:56:01 BST
If I may... Lordy! 'Reason' according to Persig, is a Greek INVENTION!
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Steven Heyman" <markheyman@infoproconsulting.com>
To: <moq_discuss@moq.org>
Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 10:32 AM
Subject: Re: MD Intellect as Consciousness
> Hi Ham,
>
> I said...
>
>> But Neanderthals are not our ancestors. There is no evidence of
>> gene flow between them and H. sapiens. You've just admitted that a
>> species other than H. sapiens is self-conscious and capable of
>> rational thought. So, how does this square with your claim that
>> self- consciousness and the ability to reason are the features that
>> set our self-exalting selves above the rest of the animal world?
>
> ham 7-23-05:
> Here's the concluding paragraph of an anthropological article on
> "Neanderthals" I found on the Internet. While Neanderthals are today
> regarded as a "sub-species" of Homo-sapiens, there's still some doubt
> as to their possible common ancestry with "modern humans". In other
> words, Science is open to new empirical evidence.
>
> msh 7-24-05:
> Point taken. The case is not closed but, from what I've read, seems
> at this point to lean toward no common ancestry. Anyway, no case is
> ever really closed in science, so you are right.
>
> ham 7-23-05:
> My point is simply that the cognitive functions exhibited by human
> beings (even humanoids in transition) far exceed those of lesser
> creatures. This, to me, suggests a teleology, a "biological
> momentum" as it were, to create a higher, "psychic" species.
>
> msh 7-24-05:
> And mine is that your anthropocentric philosophy includes the idea
> that this higher psychic species is H. sapiens, as if we are the
> teleological end-point of evolution. We are a very young species and
> may very well go extinct, either through our own "cleverness" such as
> nuclear annihilation or environmental destruction, or as a result of
> some natural catastrophe, such as what hit the dinosaurs. In either
> case, evolution will begin again, maybe with the spiders next time,
> and will arrive at highly self-aware creatures who will create
> arachnocentric religions and philosophies.
>
> ham 7-23-04:
> The fact that self-consciousness exists and is unique in nature is
> the philosophical issue we're discussing here, not the evolutionary
> mechanism behind it.
>
> msh 7-24-05:
> I see no reason to believe that self-consciousness is all that
> unique, and certainly no reason why it should be limited to a single
> species. But I agree that this is off-point for this thread. Maybe
> someone will want to take it up in another thread, later.
>
> Enjoy your vacation.
>
> Best,
> Mark Steven Heyman (msh)
> --
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>
> "The shadows that a swinging lamp will throw,
> We come from nowhere and to nothing go."
>
>
>
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