From: skutvik@online.no
Date: Tue Aug 30 2005 - 22:09:59 BST
Hi Khaled
On 29 Aug. you wrote:
> Just a small comet.
I guess this was for Arlo and Platt who keep throwing Koran
Sures at each other, but I can't help responding, it's an extremely
interesting issue.
> When has to look at the dynamics of the messenger. When Jesus came He
> was reforming an established religion under Roman ruling.
Yes, he was, but I can't help wielding the MOQ. The "movement"
called SOM - the intellectual level IMO - had been brewing for
some centuries in Greece and had surely made it over to the
southern shore of the Mediterranean so Jesus' reformation was to
add intellectual value to Judaism. Something the high priest
didn't appreciate.
> He was not challenging Caesar. The Romans looked at it as an internal
> strife between their subjects.
Right!
> When Mohammed came he was challenging the whole establishment. First
> he fled, then he fought.
In an earlier message you said:
> 1. Look at map and see where Mecca is, Not that far form the holy land. 2.
> Mohammed's brother in law was a christian priest. ( his first wife's
> brother) 3. Jews and Christian were in the neighborhood. Islam did not
> come in a vacuum 4. Mecca was already a pilgrimage destination, for what
> religion (s) I don't know 5. The old testament and the Koran agree on 99%
> of the story. ( the exception being Abraham's sacrifice
It rightly sounds like Mohammed saw some corruption to the
existing tradition by by Christians and their complicated dogmas.
> So when Islam was established, it had to become The religion, the law
> and the government.
Yes, but that is the nature of religions. There can't be a secular
state with laws separate from those given by Allah or Jahveh,, or
God. Christianity was no exception in its first millennium when
emperors and kings had to come to Rome to have their power
sanctified. And even if Israel is a secular state the orthodox Jews
don't recognize its directives as we have seen.
> It had to do that in order to survive back then.
Yes, religion is the foremost social ordering system, not only the
monotheist ones, the Myths of old were also the cement of
society, so it was to the ancient Norse, the Greeks and surely to
every culture. Later when the secular rulers appeared they had -
as said - have their power sanctified by the clergy.
> That was then and it DOES NOT work today.
No, it does not.
Bo
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