From: Elizaphanian (elizaphanian@tiscali.co.uk)
Date: Sun Mar 30 2003 - 17:35:00 BST
Hi Steve,
> I guess I should have said that Fundamentalism is anti-intellectual
instead
> of un-intellectual. The rejecting of intellect is done on the
intellectual
> level since they have a reason for rejecting it. It's just that as you
say
> it is a very low quality reason.
>
> Intellectual values for Islamic militants include blind submission and
> sacrifice to society (confused with God) and hatred of America as a
> religious duty. These are intellectual rather than social for them
because
> they are not only copied but explicitly taught.
Agreed.
> It does say something. It says that societies that foster intellectual
> freedom are better than ones that don't.
I think this is a situation where we need to be more fine-grained than that.
We agree that the fundamentalism is an intellectual pattern, it's just of
pathologically low quality. I think the West needs an analysis of
fundamentalism that does more than say that it is evil (true though that
is). To my way of thinking, it requires a greater degree of self-awareness
about religion in the West. Something I'm trying to do my little bit about.
> Again, I was too loose with language. "liberty, democracy and equality"
are
> intellectual values that are demanded by reason (as always, based on some
> set of metaphysical assumptions (which you may call some mythology? I
think
> that if you do, you are using the word in an unusual way.)) These
"wonderful
> things" are required for the intellectual level to flourish.
It is not clear to me how these things are demanded by reason. I think they
are perceptions of value, ie of high quality. I see reason as neutral
between, eg, democracy and tyranny.
As for my use of 'mythology', I'd recommend a book by Mary Midgley called
"Science as Salvation: A Modern Myth and its Meaning". That's the source for
my point about the mythology established by Bacon.
> I think you are right. Democracy does not need to be imposed, just
allowed
> to happen.
Agreed.
> Look to what the Taliban did when they came to power in Afghanistan for
> examples of the sort of social control over intellect that Bib Laden and
his
> likes would like.
OK.
Cheers
Sam
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