From: Platt Holden (pholden@sc.rr.com)
Date: Sun Apr 06 2003 - 16:20:57 BST
DMB, Scott, All:
> > > "Quality is uncharacterizable" is a self-refuting statement, as it
> > > characterizes Quality.
> >
> > Yes. To say we can't define ultimately reality is to define it.
> >
> > > Sometimes self-refuting statements are useful. Actually, I'll go
> further,
> > > and say that sometimes they are necessary.
> >
> > How so? Please explain. Like the sound of one hand clapping perhaps?
>
> DMB says:
> I don't think it needs to be all that fancy, Gents. Even if we could say
> that its indefinability constitutes a definition, which I don't think we
> can, the problem is really just one of linguistic construction. To say it
> is beyond definition is not to define it, it is simply the negation of any
> definition. The meaning of the statement is not actually self-refuting at
> all and so we don't need any ironic koans about paradoxes or anything else.
> The assertion can be re-phrased to avoid the appearance of
> self-contradiction very, very easily because its not really there in the
> first place. We could say that it is beyond all concepts, including
> definability and indefinability.
To say it is beyond all concepts is itself a concept. To say anything
meaningful at all presupposes thoughts, ideas, notions, i.e., concepts.
Linguistic constructions are concepts. Self-refuting statements are
concepts. There's one way out. "Whereof we cannot speak thereof we
must be silent." --Wittgenstein
Platt
MOQ.ORG - http://www.moq.org
Mail Archives:
Aug '98 - Oct '02 - http://alt.venus.co.uk/hypermail/moq_discuss/
Nov '02 Onward - http://www.venus.co.uk/hypermail/moq_discuss/summary.html
MD Queries - horse@darkstar.uk.net
To unsubscribe from moq_discuss follow the instructions at:
http://www.moq.org/md/subscribe.html
This archive was generated by hypermail 2.1.5 : Sun Apr 06 2003 - 16:22:01 BST