From: Steve Peterson (peterson.steve@verizon.net)
Date: Sat May 24 2003 - 22:32:02 BST
Paul, Wim, Platt, all,
I've been thinking about the distinction between the social and intellectual
level as well, Paul.
I find Wim's description of the static latch of "unconsciously copied
behavior" for the social level and "copied rationale for behavior" for the
intellectual level to be the most clear though I am still struggling to
apply
it.
(Wim, do you think it makes sense to think of the levels as levels of
awareness?)
The specific/symbolic or general distinction that you (Paul) suggest as a
distinguishing feature between levels 3 and 4 remind me of what I have been
thinking I should research and integrate with the MOQ, namely Piaget's
levels
of cognition.
I don't have time to write a detailed post about his levels right now and I
don't really know enough anyway, but you might look into his "concrete
operational" and "formal operational" stages (which successively follow the
archaic, sensori-motor, and pre-operational stages). It sounds to me like
the distinction you are making is between formal and concrete
operations.
Both levels suggest the capacity for manipulation of symbols that stand for
patterns of experience, however, I think what most of us mean by intellect
is formal operational thinking.
(Interestingly, I've read that Piaget saw concrete operational thinking as
preceding language. Others disagree. I need to look into it more since
language seems to be at issue with the level 3 and 4 divisions since it
suggests manipulation of symbols.)
I've been considering making it a bit of a summer project to look into the
MOQ from a child development point of view. I usually read discussion and
Pirsig wrote mostly about the evolution of the levels in history and
debating dating of emergence, but looking at the emergence of the levels in
the experience of a child may be just as enlightening.
My hypothesis is that a child should progress through the MOQ levels as it
matures in the same order that the levels evolved.
Within this same proposed project, I want to also compare Kolberg's
hierarchy of moral development (Pre-conventional, conventional,
post-conventional levels) with the MOQ levels.
Has anyone already looked into the MOQ from a child development point of
view that I could read in the archives? Does anyone think that this sounds
like an especially good or bad project? Platt, I remember an example with a
baby in Lila, do you know of any other instances where Pirsig touches on
this idea?
Thanks,
Steve
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