From: Valence (valence10@hotmail.com)
Date: Fri Jun 27 2003 - 01:33:04 BST
Yes, the quote came from that bio.
And just in case it helps any...One biographical detail my own research
turned up was that Verne Dusenberry (prominently mentioned in LILA) died in
1966 (see http://emuseum.mnsu.edu/bio/abcde/dusenberry_verne.html), prior to
the writing of the ZMM novel. Which means that the peyote experience Pirsig
described in which he had the initial static/dynamic insight had to pre-date
even ZMM (though it didn't make it into the novel at all).
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ian Glendinning" <ian@psybertron.org>
To: <moq_discuss@moq.org>
Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2003 7:45 PM
Subject: RE: MD 1967 or 1968 ?
> That's great Rick, everything points to 1968 being correct, and this
> development makes the exchange with the publisher before the trip all the
> more credible.
> but I have to ask "Where did you get that quote from ?"
> (The same biog details you photocopied from the library source you
mentioned
> earlier perhaps ?)
> Ian
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-moq_discuss@venus.co.uk
> [mailto:owner-moq_discuss@venus.co.uk]On Behalf Of Valence
> Sent: 26 June 2003 22:51
> To: moq_discuss@moq.org
> Subject: Re: MD 1967 or 1968 ?
>
>
> Hey Ian,
> Here's what I've got...
>
> "...From 1963 to 1967 Pirsig worked as a technical writer in Minneapolis.
> He originally conceived of [ZMM] as a short, light-hearted philosophical
> essay, but following a 1968 cross-country motorcycle trip on which he
later
> based the narrative, he reworked the text into his present form."
>
>
>
> rick
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Ian Glendinning" <ian@psybertron.org>
> To: <moq_discuss@moq.org>
> Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2003 5:15 PM
> Subject: MD 1967 or 1968 ?
>
>
> > As a newbie I'm presuming I'm still allowed to ask naive questions ....
> ;-)
> >
> > I cannot find any categorical statements about the year of the ZMM trip.
> > Some infer 1967, some 1968.
> >
> > A point I find intriguing is that if it was 1968 (as can easily be
> inferred
> > from the 25th edition notes, including the 1968 letters between Pirsig
and
> > the publisher), then he had the publication of a book planned before he
> made
> > the trip, which will cast a whole new light next time I re-read it.
> >
> > So was it 1968, or was it '67 ?
> >
> > Ian
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-moq_discuss@venus.co.uk
> > [mailto:owner-moq_discuss@venus.co.uk]On Behalf Of Platt Holden
> > Sent: 27 June 2003 21:13
> > To: moq_discuss@moq.org
> > Subject: Re: MD The Transformation of Love
> >
> >
> > Dear Wim,
> >
> > > Platt wrote 26 Jun 2003 07:59:20 -0400:
> > > 'It bothers me, however, that you categorize persons as mere social
> > > patterns, the realm where the Giant rules. We know what the Giant does
> to
> > > persons; he has them for lunch. Better to think of persons as
> individuals
> > > possessing intellect that can improve life by responding to DQ. That
way
> > > persons are less likely to end up as fodder for the Giant's ugly
> > ambitions.
> > > It was the guarantee of individual rights as protection against the
> > > appetite of the Giant that made the USA unique and helped draw
powerful
> > > intellects from all over the world to its shores, yearning to be
free.'
> >
> > Wim:
> > > People participate in both social and intellectual patterns of value.
> 'The
> > > Giant', or a cluster of social patterns of values, not only 'devours
> > > people' in the sense of making them replaceable elements in a status
> > > hierarchy. It is also used by people to give their life Meaning by
> > striving
> > > to rise in that status hierarchy and by identifying with the Giant and
> its
> > > contributions to humanity. Clusters of intellectual patterns of
values,
> > > like science, can also 'devour people' in the sense of making them
> > > replaceable propagators of sets of ideas. I hope you're aware that the
> USA
> > > can also be experienced as a Giant?
> >
> > Yes, the USA can be experienced as a Giant as can any city or country on
> > earth. Also, unfortunately, there are many people who identify with the
> > Giant as their primary means of defining themselves rather than as
> > individual, free thinkers and responders to DQ.
> >
> > As for the Giant's "contributions to humanity," he cuts both ways,
raising
> > up millions by providing myriads of opportunities and slaughtering
> > millions in his quest for power. It's the down side, often disguised as
> > being for the "public good," that we need to watch out for. Communism
was
> > sold to the Russians as helping them.
> >
> > As for clusters of intellectual patterns devouring people, that sounds
> > like meme theory, in which case you and I have become unwitting victims
> > and replaceable propagators of Pirsig's ideas, a theory I flatly reject.
> >
> > Having said all that, I would be foolish not to acknowledge the
influence
> > of the Giant and ideas originated by others on my individuality.
Hopefully
> > I'm not a complete clone of my culture . . . or my MD collaborators. :-)
> >
> > Platt
> >
> >
> >
> > MOQ.ORG - http://www.moq.org
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> >
> >
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