From: David MOREY (us@divadeus.freeserve.co.uk)
Date: Tue Nov 18 2003 - 18:54:19 GMT
Nathan
This is asking the right questions.
But how do you tell that something has intentional states?
Does not sticking to the rules imply wilL or chance rather than
predictable causality? Agency, I think, is all about having
possibilities (plural) rather than only a single possibility (where we
ascribe classic causality). The Earth, of course, is full of possibilities
because life effects the Earth's future. So it gets complex. What is so
characteristic about human agency is its individuality, such that we are
structured in our conscious existence by having certain individual
possibilities:
shall I go for a walk, do this job, marry this woman, etc. Maybe, when we
ask
is the Earth alive, we are limited by having a rather human perspective on
what
agency is. Take a look at this to open up some different ideas for you about
cosmic processes:
http://www.levity.com/mavericks/rupert.htm
regards
David M
----- Original Message -----
From: "Nathan Pila" <pila@sympatico.ca>
To: <moq_discuss@moq.org>
Sent: Monday, November 17, 2003 9:06 PM
Subject: MD It is ALIVE!!
> David,
>
> I know that there are some people who want to say that the earth is alive.
> But for me, I would say it is not alive. One of the attributes of living
> creatures is intentionality. That is, in a living organism, there is
> something other than matter. There is for lack of a better word, something
I
> will call "WILL". Something that is alive has some autonomy and can
violate
> rules if it so chooses to.
>
> I may have a thousand reasons to do X; it may be in my best interests and
> yet decide to do Y just because I want to. The earth is just is; it sits
> there and is acted upon.
>
> Do you agree with any of this?
>
> Nathan
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "David MOREY" <us@divadeus.freeserve.co.uk>
> To: <moq_discuss@moq.org>
> Sent: Monday, November 17, 2003 10:07 AM
> Subject: Re: MD what is life?
>
>
> > Hi
> >
> > The earth is an interesting one. Not what we would usually
> > think of as an organism. Life has done a good job at making
> > the earth inhabitable. And the stability of the environment for
> > maintaining life is impressive. It is also a very complex total system
> > interacting with the space environment. Where purposeful activity
> > is involved in this is hard to say, I would not dismis it on
metaphysical
> > grounds as per SOM too quickly. It needs investigating. What do you
think?
> >
> > regards
> > David M
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Nathan Pila" <pila@sympatico.ca>
> > To: <moq_discuss@moq.org>
> > Sent: Sunday, November 16, 2003 11:03 PM
> > Subject: Re: MD what is life?
> >
> >
> > > David,
> > >
> > > Using what you wrote, would you say that the earth is alive as a
> organism?
> > > And what about a liver cell? Is it alive?
> > >
> > > Regards, Nathan
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "David MOREY" <us@divadeus.freeserve.co.uk>
> > > To: <moq_discuss@moq.org>
> > > Sent: Sunday, November 16, 2003 11:37 AM
> > > Subject: Re: MD what is life?
> > >
> > >
> > > > Hi
> > > >
> > > > Seems easy to me, life fills all the levels of complexity
> > > > after those that create the most determinate level of matter.
> > > > Life exhibits a level of free activity above that which is only
> > > > concerned with the contingent interaction of elements.
> > > > Life makes a use of its environment. There is also a use
> > > > from energy to particles to atoms to molecules but we
> > > > do not call this life because the movement is away from free
> > > > movement towards heavy, stationary, gravity loving, and determined
> > > > elements, the most static patterns that exist.
> > > >
> > > > regards
> > > > David M
> > > >
> > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > From: "Magnus Berg" <McMagnus@home.se>
> > > > To: <moq_discuss@moq.org>
> > > > Sent: Sunday, November 16, 2003 10:18 AM
> > > > Subject: re: MD what is life?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > Hi Nathan
> > > > >
> > > > > I mostly lurk nowadays but if you are interested in my take on
life,
> > > feel
> > > > free to read "A classicist's road to the Metaphysics of Quality" in
> the
> > > MoQ
> > > > forum:
> > > > >
> > > > > http://www.moq.org/forum/magnus/magnus.html
> > > > >
> > > > > Magnus
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > "Nathan Pila" <pila@sympatico.ca> wrote:
> > > > > __________
> > > > > >Hi there Steve,
> > > > > >
> > > > > >Well, I would assert that the study of "life" is worthwhile even
if
> > it
> > > is
> > > > an
> > > > > >illusion. Right now, a definition that is accepted by everyone
has
> > yet
> > > to
> > > > be
> > > > > >formulated. How can one tell if some material is "alive". What
> > > properties
> > > > > >would such material exhibit?
> > > > > >
> > > > > >How would you, (Steve)/ (or anyone else) /define 'life'? I am
aware
> > > that
> > > > I
> > > > > >am not being fair here in that this question is easy to state and
> > > > terribly
> > > > > >difficult to answer. But if you have the time, I would be
> interested
> > in
> > > > some
> > > > > >of the properties that you think 'life' has. I have some views on
> the
> > > > > >subject based on some stuff I've read. But I would like to hear
> what
> > > you
> > > > > >write first.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >Regards, Nathan
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
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