From: David MOREY (us@divadeus.freeserve.co.uk)
Date: Thu Dec 04 2003 - 19:22:14 GMT
Hi All
I find this split between socialist/capitalist
equals good/bad or bad/good very simplistic.
Capitalism has clearly produced the greatest productive
power and tech knowledge ever seen on earth, being centralised does not mean
ineffective -think ancient Rome, and was eastern communist
Europe dull? well in what terms, when the two Germanies
rejoined there was a great burst of extra interest in the finer
arts and music because of the greater education/interest of the east
Germans in culture compared to western 'entertainment' of the poor
quality hollywood-style. Is that mixed up enough for you?
Would it be fair to say that the US has not been very unimpressive
at producing quality culture? Or am I badly informed in the Europe
of Kant/Einstein/Newton/Blake/Plato/Descartes/Hegel/etc etc
and a lot of this under bad old monarchies, of course. Not quite
sure what my point is, except history is very complicated.
regards
David M
----- Original Message -----
From: Valuemetaphysics@aol.com
To: moq_discuss@moq.org
Sent: Wednesday, December 03, 2003 11:51 PM
Subject: Re: MD Democracy in the MOQ
Platt:
Consider the aesthetics of the following scenarios:
Scenario 1: You walk into a store, buy a pack of cigarettes, light up,
inhale the smoke and enjoy a pleasurable experience.
Scenario 2: You're taken from your home in the middle of the night,
thrown into a boxcar, forced to strip, pushed into a shower room,
inhale poison gas and suffer termination of all your experiences
forever.
The scenarios illustrate that there isn't a single capitalist who has
the power of the lowliest government bureaucrat because, as Mao
observed, "Political power grows out of the barrel of a gun." Until
capitalists can force you to buy their products by putting a pistol to
your head, the aesthetic comparison between socialists and capitalists
is like comparing an M240B machine gun with a Michelangelo.
Mark 04-12-03: Hello Platt, You put me to shame. :-(
Socialists and other proponents of big government do a splendid job of
covering up the brutal nature of their power by hiding it under the
cover of "doing good." Without exception every authoritarian ruler
gained control by appealing to the "public interest" or the "greater
good of all." But on an aesthetic scale, the collective interest is
nothing compared to individual liberty. As Pirsig so rightly points out
in describing Dynamic Quality, "Its only perceived good is freedom and
its only perceived evil is static quality," reflecting his later
explanation of why socialist cities are "always dull" places.
Mark 04-12-03: My head hangs. :-(
You and I are champions of the aesthetic nature of the MOQ. Neither of
us would tolerate some no-nothing bureaucrat hired under an affirmative
action plan telling a Jamie Wyeth what he should paint, or a Yefrim
Bronfman what piano works he should play. So the question is, why
should we tolerate any bureaucrat or politician telling you or me what
to do or how we should spend our money? Why should we allow anyone to
violate our aesthetic natures? Or, our next door neighbour's?
Mark 04-12-03: Indeed. More shame on my part. :-(
So I appeal to you on aesthetic grounds to renounce the whips, guns and
concentration camps of socialism and instead turn your considerable
aesthetic and intellectual powers to promote Dynamic Quality freedom.
And thank goodness you don't have to wait around for any
"intersubjective agreement" to make the change. As Pirsig said, "A
tribe can changes its values only person by person and someone has to
be first." In other words, individuals change things for the better,
not street mobs.
Best regards,
Platt
Platt
Mark 04-12-03: All i ever wanted was to have the necessities of life given freely to all - water, food, heating and friendship. If that makes me a restrictor of freedom then i need to do some serious thinking.
All the best,
Mark
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